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A warning to the unwary...


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You won't experience this shonky crap on this site because this site is not about selling systems (though there are several tried and tested available). This site is about players helping players navigate the nuances of Baccarat.

Don't fall into the trap of thinking that the more you are charged for a system or to attend a Seminar...the better your chances of winning or you may find yourself in the same boat as this somewhat disgruntled would be Baccarat Player from another site who most likely outlaid over $1250 for the privilege off getting scammed.

May 10, 2017 at 10:26 am#4657

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stevep
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It's done the long-awaited final word.  My opinion the 24 pages are much less than was promised, and it appears to be a piece of crap.

 

Don't say that you weren't warned

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On 5/13/2017 at 0:49 PM, mtman said:

Actually BigChips it sounds like they really kicked some ass in Vegas this week.   Ellis said they cleaned out the tray using his new ANB system.  Just maybe he's got something worthwhile with that?

 

 

Absolute rubbish...it was two shoes playing red and green.

The question has to be asked...Why would you be still be playing red and green chips after playing an invincible system for several days?...I wouldn't bother getting out of bed to play Red and Green FFS!...and why are there no reports on any other shoes played?

I've tested ANB myself hoping that it might work because the thought involved in the way I play just tires out my brain sometimes. 

Read my lips..."ANB IS NOT WHAT IT IS MADE OUT TO BE!"...It loses as many shoes as it wins and can hit your STOP/LOSS as quick as any system I've ever tested.

I make my living playing Baccarat and I refuse to waste any more time testing ANB...but rest assured..."IF YOU PLAY ANB LONG TERM...YOU WILL LOSE AND LOSE BIG...IT'S NOT A MATTER OF IF...ONLY A MATTER OF WHEN!"

If you want to piss your money up against a wall ...go for it...but don't say that you weren't warned.

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1 minute ago, BigChips said:

Exactly!!!!    I would be embarassed putting on a seminar with many people playing red or green    The only reason for doing that and not playing blacks or purples is   (A),   You don't have much money   Or   (B)   You are not very confident in your system

 

I'm thinking (A) and (B) 

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you mean oz, toasted  ytoasted your brains out trying out ANB, I was there from Monday-Wednesday,  the whole day,they didn't show their asses.well,maybe dean (tuesday midnight) in his ragetty outfit and a couple of top gun cohorts (hair gone from figuring out ANB) of ellis.Besides, why would Ellis stay up late night? well as soon as dean showed up I cashed out with my winnings and never bother to witnessed ANB! 

One more thing, Sunday why play stadium baccarat Sunday at palazzo with ANB? Are you embarrassed that ANB didn't worked? where's proof of your winning scorecards?

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2 or 3 shoes means nothing in the grand scheme of things...we have heard it all before and corroboration from the usual suspects who can tell you what colour underwear Ellis wears each day doesn't cut the ice.  There were several independent witnesses in Vegas and they couldn't catch up with Ellis. I wonder why that is?

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I agree...It's sheer idiocy to be betting after the first hand...3 to 4 completed events at a minimum and SAP really comes into it's own mid shoe...

We do have a lot to thank Ellis for...The scorecard...OR count...SAP(a brilliant concept)...NOR...RD1...etc

Unfortunately...He also gave us Negative Progressions with their inevitable consequences and a mindset that Baccarat can be beaten with minimal effort.

ANB may prove to be a winner long term but not without a lot of tweaking and the starting procedure of betting after the first hand is beyond stupid. There are way too many obstacles for ANB despite the Hype... and it needs to be used only in the right situations. 

After I tested several shoes and experienced the probs, I didn't bother playing whole shoes...just the starts which enabled a more comprehensive study. I was hitting unrealistic STOP/LOSSES way too often. 

Naturally...Ellis's disciples will defend him to the hilt but their opinion is hardly a good recommendation. Offhand I can't think of one that I would let place a bet with my Mother in laws money...Einsteins...they ain't.

 

Edited by ECD
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I agree OZ..... I re-read his trip report and was a little shocked to read about him and his cfc boys playing read and greenchips, and the guys that were copying his bets played black and took them all.   Hell if I had an "invincible" system, I would damn sure be playing black and purple, if not purple and yellow/orange!

why in the hell is Ellis playing for peanuts when he supposedly has the keys to the city?!!   I think you are right Big Chips and OZ.....maybe a combo of a and b.

things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmm!   Lol

 

 fwiw, I do give credit to Ellis for teaching me how to play this game and win consistently.... I just wish he would find that damn holy grail someday!   Lol

Edited by mtman
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4 minutes ago, mtman said:

I agree OZ..... I re-read his trip report and was a little shocked to read about him and his cfc boys playing read and greenchips, and the guys that were copying his bets played black and took them all.   Hell if I had an "invincible" system, I would damn sure be playing black and purple, if not purple and yellow/orange!

why in the hell is Ellis playing for peanuts when he supposedly has the keys to the city?!!   I think you are right Big Chips and OZ.....maybe a combo of a and b.

things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmm!   Lol

 

I'm pretty sure that the Chip Tray on a $10 min Table only has $70K all up. The Dealers at any half decent Casino don't even blink at a single $50K bet and are hardly likely to have a massive anxiety/panic attack over several players taking them for $70K in a whole shoe. No doubt they figure that they'll get it all back (and then some)...and they will most likely be right.

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Here is the problem for the newer members who are thinking to themselves, "Maybe he has it and I need to switch forums" or " I will purchase the ANB and do both forums"

The advice you get from any of the accomplished players on this forum have a few things in common:

THEY HAVE GONE THROUGH EVERY "CAN'T MISS" SYSTEM THAT ELLIS COMES UP WITH EVERY SIX MONTHS OR SO. 

It really gets nauseating when Ellis uses his "Cookie Cutter"  jargon as he describes his latest and greatest scheme to extract money from unsuspecting people who just want to learn the game.  

I reviewed the FW and I find it hard to believe that it was written by a person with an alleged 160IQ.  If you are writing a manual, rule #1 is that you need it to be as detailed as it can so a three year old can understand it.   As with all of his other manual, it is difficult to follow.  

For entertainment purposes, I monitor the public area of CFC.  As with most of the players who are on to Ellis, I have been banned from the private forum (Being banned is sort of an accomplishment because you are perceived as a threat).   Here is what everyone needs to know:

COOKIE CUTTER JARGON

  • "WE HAVE BETTER PA/ROI THAN A CARD COUNTER".
  • "HELL, WE TIP MORE THAN THAT". 
  • "THE CASINOS HAVE CAUGHT UP TO US, THAT IS WHY WE HAVE TO CHANGE THE WAY WE PLAY"

The one thing all this jargon has in common is that it was used for MDB, RSAP, LCNB, MvD and now ANB.   Also, I think it is virtually impossible to clean out a tray betting red and green.  The final thing to mention is that the casinos are not even concerned in the slightest over the guys betting red and green.  Ellis is not even a blip on their radar but he is acting like a whale they fly in to play.  Please all,  don't fall for it. 

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Well said Vinnie and I couldn't agree more.

I can't believe the excitement generated by playing Reds and Greens...seriously...these guys sound like they were pissing their pants(Ellis included)...Childish amateur behaviour and I would have expected more from Ellis at least. (Reading between the lines..."Oh shit...we are actually winning...I wasn't expecting that...LOL")

I pride myself in not showing emotion when I play ...WIN or LOSE...but just to make each play as the shoe dictates...and I'm definitely not playing Reds and Greens. I hit the Table Max once (only time ever in my career) and the only words I said as I tallied my chips were when I replied to the "Bosses" encouragement to keep riding my luck ..."Do I really look that stupid?"  In retrospect...very unprofessional of me...but "HEY"...I'm old...you gotta make some allowances.

 

Just to reiterate...even "He who must be worshiped and adored" admits that ANB is losing shoes, but for a good reason...There's always a reason...It can't possibly be that there is no such thing as a "Mechanical Foolproof System"...can it?...LOL

Edited by ECD
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25 minutes ago, johnnycs1 said:

Didn't Ellis just recently come out with ANB ??

How do guys know how to play it ?

thanks ..johnny/ albuquerque

 
 
 

Ellis's "Loyal" disciples aren't nearly as loyal as he thinks. I have received several copies of ANB

The only thing stopping me plastering ANB over the whole damn Internet is that I don't want to be responsible for people losing money.

 

Edited by ECD
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16 minutes ago, johnnycs1 said:

Didn't Ellis just recently come out with ANB ??

The name may be new, but there have been countless iterations of net betting P v B over the last three years.  I have a binder full of various testing I did for Ellis on at least 3 or 4 different versions.  About all you can really vary is how many bets you make under certain events until you suspend, and those decisions impact just how quickly it gets on a run of streaks or chops.   Net betting PvB will do well in certain shoes (like any system), and increasing your base bet on streaks will magnify possible gains (I'm sure this is part of ANB -- a fallback rule for Ellis).  However, I guarantee that if you just play it blindly from shoe to shoe starting at hand 2, you will not win in the long run.  A purely mechanical system betting almost every hand will get eaten alive over time.

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I'm expecting Ellis's "attack dogs" (Disciples) to come at me hard. Good luck with that fellas...think long and hard, because I promise you...within 24 hours I will have ANB plastered over every gambling site on the Net.

You know that I'm a vindictive old prick...and if I say it...I mean it.

Relax...take it easy...don't get your knickers in a twist...you know Ellis will come up with another unloseable system in a few weeks.

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34 minutes ago, ozscouser1 said:

I'm expecting Ellis's "attack dogs" (Disciples) to come at me hard. Good luck with that fellas...think long and hard, because I promise you...within 24 hours I will have ANB plastered over every gambling site on the Net.

You know that I'm a vindictive old prick...and if I say it...I mean it.

Relax...take it easy...don't get your knickers in a twist...you know Ellis will come up with another unloseable system in a few weeks.

I dont know, does he really thinks after all this years playing baccarat with that great IQ that mechanical system that plays every hand can beat bacc easilly, or he knows that majority of peoples look for system like that ?

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21 minutes ago, Blitz said:

I dont know, does he really thinks after all this years playing baccarat with that great IQ that mechanical system that plays every hand can beat bacc easilly, or he knows that majority of peoples look for system like that ?

I think Ellis is too experienced and too smart to believe it.  He would tell you its what his students want (a simple system that plays every hand), so he is just a system designer fulfilling a demand.  Philosophically I have a problem with an approach that avoids teaching students how to WIN just because it may take some work and be a little harder than we all wish it was.

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Maybe the same reason why we are still driving internal combustion oil dependant cars and why we haven't got a cure for cancer and many other illnesses

What we do get is a slightly more efficient engine available at a higher price or a more effective pharmaceutical drug available at a higher price

We keep hoping and we keep paying but all we ever get is the next best thing available at a higher price.

And all the while its worth more money to some people to never actually present something that works too well.

 

Fortunately with baccarat you can research in your own lab (your home) and design your own strategy that will be as close to the HG FOR YOU as you can get

Just takes time, persistence, and practise - maybe 2 - 3 years I would suggest

Of course wise men learn by their mistakes but wiser men learn from keen observation so if you read every post on this site It will cut down your research and design time greatly.

 

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On 5/15/2017 at 4:30 PM, way2fast said:

Philosophically I have a problem with an approach that avoids teaching students how to WIN just because it may take some work and be a little harder than we all wish it was.

I could not agree more with that statement.  The best teacher I ever had, shared the truth of..."it's one thing to know what to do, and quite another matter in knowing HOW to.  The teacher/leader, must not only teach WHAT, they must also teach HOW TO."   "The WHAT is easy.....the HOW TO is where the work and learning takes place.  

example.....I knew I had to repair and remodel my place after a tree fell on it and damaged it. That's the WHAT.   I didn't know how to in some regards.  So I had to learn HOW TO.  I gave free week of labor to a carpenter if he would show me how to build outside and inside walls.  I gave a free week of labor to a plumber if he would show me how to run and attach plumbing from an outside water source into the house.  Lastly I gave a free week of labor to an electrician if he would show me how to run the electric from outlets to light sockets, etc.  

So it's both....the "What" and "How to" teacher that is the best there is.  It's not about telling someone "WHAT" to do.....it's teaching and showing them "HOW TO".   

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I played a shoe with ANB yesterday EXACTLY according to the ANB rules. 

H10 -13 with a 6 bet due (to be fair...it won but that means your STOP/LOSS has to be -19 to make that bet)

H22 -27 with a 7 unit bet due (which it also won...S/L -34...but then lost the following 5 unit bet which everything I know about Baccarat was screaming at me not to make but ANB says the bet had to be made)

It really takes a special kind of system to get to -27 in 22 hands...

H22...17 actual bets made...4 WINNING BETS!!!...FFS...I could get my dog to crap on my scorecard and do better than that...

For those still considering purchasing ANB...Trust me...The purchase price is the least of your worries...Read my lips... "ANB IS A LICENCE TO LOSE MONEY"... Caveat emptor

 

So saying...My mentor has discovered a way to make ANB work but at best it would give the worshipers of "He who must be adored" a huge headache...requires way too much thought for their feeble brains...LOL 

Edited by ECD
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52 minutes ago, ozscouser1 said:

I played a shoe with ANB yesterday EXACTLY according to the ANB rules. 

H10 -13 with a 6 bet due (to be fair...it won but that means your STOP/LOSS has to be -19 to make that bet)

H22 -27 with a 7 unit bet due (which it also won...S/L -34...but then lost the following 5 unit bet which everything I know about Baccarat was screaming at me not to make but ANB says the bet had to be made)

It really takes a special kind of system to get to -27 in 22 hands...

H22...17 actual bets made...4 WINNING BETS!!!...FFS...I could get my dog to crap on my scorecard and do better than that...

For those still considering purchasing ANB...Trust me...The purchase price is the least of your worries...Read my lips... "ANB IS A LICENCE TO LOSE MONEY"... Caveat emptor

 

So saying...My mentor has discovered a way to make ANB work but at best it would give the worshipers of "He who must be adored" a huge headache...requires way too much thought for their feeble brains...LOL 

Maybe you didnt played right shoe

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35 minutes ago, Blitz said:

Maybe you didnt played right shoe

LOL...:lol:

My Mentor has since scrapped his improved ANB...as far as I am concerned, his Baccarat Brain is equal to the "best of the best"...If he can't make ANB work...I doubt anyone can.

Watch for extreme editing and censorship of CFC Posts as more and more people discover the truth.

 

 Caveat emptor

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1 hour ago, ozscouser1 said:

I played a shoe with ANB yesterday EXACTLY according to the ANB rules. 

H10 -13 with a 6 bet due (to be fair...it won but that means your STOP/LOSS has to be -19 to make that bet)

H22 -27 with a 7 unit bet due (which it also won...S/L -34...but then lost the following 5 unit bet which everything I know about Baccarat was screaming at me not to make but ANB says the bet had to be made)

It really takes a special kind of system to get to -27 in 22 hands...

H22...17 actual bets made...4 WINNING BETS!!!...FFS...I could get my dog to crap on my scorecard and do better than that...

For those still considering purchasing ANB...Trust me...The purchase price is the least of your worries...Read my lips... "ANB IS A LICENCE TO LOSE MONEY"... Caveat emptor

 

So saying...My mentor has discovered a way to make ANB work but at best it would give the worshipers of "He who must be adored" a huge headache...requires way too much thought for their feeble brains...LOL 

 

A new, "world's greatest", system is released and everyone wants to focus on how many units it can win.  It's human nature -- we want to win and we are optimistic, so when we hear a system won 20 units in one shoe and 30 units in another, we want to believe the best system has been found and all we have to do now is go play in mechanically in a live casino and play the same type of shoes.  What is forgotten is that the "casino" was not born yesterday.  They are ruthless protectors of their money and they will welcome the opportunity to strip you of your very last dollar without batting an eye.

When I look at ways to play the game, rather than focusing on the type of shoe or event pattern the system "works" on, I prefer to understand what can happen if things are not going according to plan (which happens in the real casino world).

Take ANB.  The developer acknowledges it won't beat every shoe, but he attributes that to just "being unlucky"  ( seems a little naïve!).  He also says it or OTBL will win every shoe (also a bit naïve), but that you should stick with ANB at least until after you have lost a 6 unit bet (I will withhold my views as a professional about even contemplating making a 6 unit bet).

So what does it take to get to that 6 unit bet, and how much will you have lost at that point when decide to switch systems?  Turns out its not so difficult to get to that 6 unit bet, and when you do you could be down -32 units already.  Consider a not so unique shoe pattern of B122311222.  Playing ANB you make and lose a 6 unit bet on hand 16, to go down -32 units, having made just 11 bets in those 16 hands.

The measure of a system is not how much you MIGHT win, but how much you MIGHT lose and whether you are wiling to accept that win/loss trade-off.  For me, playing a system where I can lose $32,000 or more in 11 bets is unacceptable, and illogical when it is relatively routine to win several thousand in those same number of hands.  For each his own.

Edited by ECD
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