Bet Phoenix Online Play

[MVSeahog]

For those of you who may be thinking about "online" play, may I offer this basic primer on "How to Play Online".

1. Find out if you CAN play online. US players obviously have very few places where they can play for real. The rest of the world has many more choices for sure.

2. Once you find a valid casino, PRACTICE on it using their free LIVE games. If they don't allow you to play for free, LIVE, then don't play there. If you're not comfortable with their game, don't play there. If you don't trust it or just feel funny about something, don't play it. It's your money and you can take it anywhere you want that makes YOU feel good to be playing.

3. Make a small deposit and make sure there's no funny business with your credit card, debit card, gift card or cash account. In my case I deposited $200 and played on the $5 table. That's 40 units to see if I could win with a decent play, online.

4. Play for small stakes at first. Not just the first few games, but perhaps a full MONTH before even thinking about raising your wagers.

5. Now once you're ahead in your account a bit, try to make a withdrawl (either your original deposit or whatever the minimum is) and see what the process is for positive identification and all that. If you're taking money out, there are a lot of things that you may have to produce to get paid the first time.

6. Do NOT, under any circumstances, take any casino bonus that is offered, EVER. More people have had more problems pulling their money out if they still have "bonus" money that needs to be cleared.

7. The casino will be there every day. If the video feed is bad, out of sync, doesn't look right or anything, just exit the table and come back another day. There's never any reason to force your play if the video/sync is poor.

8. Don't attempt to eat dinner and play baccarat at the same time. Set aside the time to play the table and close the door. Come out of your computer room AFTER you're done playing, not in the middle of a game.

9. And finally, test, test, test and practice with the game you're going to play so that NOTHING surprises you when you start clicking on the real money button the first few times. Also, think about leaving your early games with any kind of a profit. If you're up 5 units in your first shoe, don't even THINK about giving it all back. Leave if you drop to +2 and call it a win! You can always come back tomorrow. Walking out of your computer room with a "win" always feels good, no matter how many units it turned out to be.

MVS

[Guest]

For those of you who may be thinking about "online" play, may I offer this basic primer on "How to Play Online".

1. Find out if you CAN play online. US players obviously have very few places where they can play for real. The rest of the world has many more choices for sure.

2. Once you find a valid casino, PRACTICE on it using their free LIVE games. If they don't allow you to play for free, LIVE, then don't play there. If you're not comfortable with their game, don't play there. If you don't trust it or just feel funny about something, don't play it. It's your money and you can take it anywhere you want that makes YOU feel good to be playing.

3. Make a small deposit and make sure there's no funny business with your credit card, debit card, gift card or cash account. In my case I deposited $200 and played on the $5 table. That's 40 units to see if I could win with a decent play, online.

4. Play for small stakes at first. Not just the first few games, but perhaps a full MONTH before even thinking about raising your wagers.

5. Now once you're ahead in your account a bit, try to make a withdrawl (either your original deposit or whatever the minimum is) and see what the process is for positive identification and all that. If you're taking money out, there are a lot of things that you may have to produce to get paid the first time.

6. Do NOT, under any circumstances, take any casino bonus that is offered, EVER. More people have had more problems pulling their money out if they still have "bonus" money that needs to be cleared.

7. The casino will be there every day. If the video feed is bad, out of sync, doesn't look right or anything, just exit the table and come back another day. There's never any reason to force your play if the video/sync is poor.

8. Don't attempt to eat dinner and play baccarat at the same time. Set aside the time to play the table and close the door. Come out of your computer room AFTER you're done playing, not in the middle of a game.

9. And finally, test, test, test and practice with the game you're going to play so that NOTHING surprises you when you start clicking on the real money button the first few times. Also, think about leaving your early games with any kind of a profit. If you're up 5 units in your first shoe, don't even THINK about giving it all back. Leave if you drop to +2 and call it a win! You can always come back tomorrow. Walking out of your computer room with a "win" always feels good, no matter how many units it turned out to be.

MVS

That is the best collection of advice on online Bac I've ever seen! Thanks MVS!

I'd like to add one more piece of advice: Just yesterday a member told me that he won 39 out of 40 shoes online playing my old System Zero. The way he was playing it, the nemesis was multiple straight 6 iars. The norm for straight 6s is one every 2 shoes.

But as soon as he raised his unit from $10 to $100 he lost 3 straight shoes to an impossible number of back to back 6 iars. This even though he did NOT play his $100 shoes back to back. He waited several hours to begin each shoe. But no matter how long he waited, he got 6 iars as soon as he started playing. So he went back to $10 units and started winning every shoe again.

I said look John, they were obviously laying for you. You have two choices. Either you can be satisfied playing $10 units

or: you can attempt to turn the tables on their obvious cheating. Start your System Zero normally but then switch to the reverse of System Zero. Play opposites instead of repeats so that your nemesis is now ZZ 6 iars.

I have not heard the results yet but recognize that there are no guarantees. They can beat him either way if they are doing what I suspect they are doing.

Trick shoes!

This was quite common in the old days and several casinos were caught and shut down for their efforts. What I worry about is the ones that were NOT caught.

There are several types of trick shoes. But the one I'm thinking of involves an open slot in the bottom of the shoe. Your predator simply slips the next hand into the bottom of the shoe and the next hand dealt is whatever your predator wants. You lose!

Yeah, yeah, I know. You think casinos would never cheat. That is only because you haven't been around as long as I have. I've caught them cheating right under our nose in REAL casinos hundreds of times. You are playing ONLINE for crying out loud where cheating is far easier.

My advice is this: If you have good reason to suspect they are cheating - they probably are! What's to stop them? They are offshore for crying out loud where they are not subject to any kind of oversight. Change casinos.

I've heard this same sad story too many times. That is why I don't play online casinos. Real casinos cheat enough!

Edited December 11, 2012 by Guest

[kramden]

Hi Guys!

Thanks for the advice MVS.

A few questions:

1. How do you make deposits? via credit card?

2. Your withdrawals are by a paper check mailed to you? (I guess there is a fee? and they are cashable in US banks?)

3. Besides a drivers license, how much deeper is the personal info required? (can you use other form of photo iD instead?)

4. Have you ever gone with large units at any time? maybe when winning did you raise them? Any problem there?

5. Do you play and win every day? If not, what is your losing to winning session ratio? (in other words, will consistent winning flag them?)

more to follow I'm sure, haha

Thank you!!

Also, Ellis, what casino did the member you mentioned play at?

Anyone else who plays online, will you please give your input as I am deciding to set up an account to play bac at very soon.

Thanks guys!!

Kramden

[kramden]

MVS, also,

before I set this up...

1. betphoenix.ag does not have a practice area? or does it?

2. Did you set up any separate email adresses or bank/credit accounts to use specifically for that site?

3. Any other "defense mechanisms" that I need to set up?

THANX!!!

[MVSeahog]

Hi Guys!

Thanks for the advice MVS.

A few questions:

1. How do you make deposits? via credit card?

Yes, at the time I made my deposit, a credit card was used but they processed it through a third party rather than the actual casino. Another way was to have them make a single "cash advance" and use that as the deposit. It's not the best way, but sometimes it's the only way. Most casinos will reimburse your "fees" for this type of transaction.

2. Your withdrawals are by a paper check mailed to you? (I guess there is a fee? and they are cashable in US banks?)

Yes, a paper check, drawn on a Canadian bank. No problems depositing to my local bank and getting paid. I only take the once a month free check when I make the withdrawl. There's no need to pay for express mail, express anything. Once a month is sufficient and you get one free one a month. The last check arrived in 3 business days via FedEx.

3. Besides a drivers license, how much deeper is the personal info required? (can you use other form of photo iD instead?)

I guess it depends on what the powers that be are looking for. My DL, a utility bill, the front and back of the credit card I used to fund the account and a photo of me holding the credit card were what they asked from me but those things may have changed by now as I only did that indentification once when I signed up.

4. Have you ever gone with large units at any time? maybe when winning did you raise them? Any problem there?

I've moved to green chip play from time to time and made the 6 unit bets with no probems. My "normal" play is on the $10 table so raising my wagers in generally when on a nice streak where I can parlay part of the winnings.

5. Do you play and win every day? If not, what is your losing to winning session ratio? (in other words, will consistent winning flag them?)

more to follow I'm sure, haha

Kramden

Well, I know it's going to sound trite but I generally track my wins/losses by the week and month. Losing a session of 5 or 8 usints is not a big deal when at the end of the week it's showing a profit, no matter how small. I've been playing there about three years now and although my winnings aren't about to buy me a new boat (the old one is doing just fine) they haven't kicked me off. I'll let EVERYBODY know when they boot me for winning "too much"!!!!!

Seriously, the reports from people who were "booted" because they won too much are generally overblown and when the details are actually tracked down, usually false anyway. I figure if I'm winning too much and get booted from an online casino, by then I should be chartering a Lear Jet and heading to Vegas anyway!

Hope this helps.

ALSO .......

Be sure and read the entire sign up agreement with whatever casino you're planning on using. Then reread it again and make sure you understand ALL of the payout requirements. If you don't understand them, call their 800 number and start asking questions.

Once again, read the sign up agreement and make sure you understand it. This is very important so that you understand the agreement you're getting into.

(end of sermon)

MVS

[MVSeahog]

MVS, also,

before I set this up...

1. betphoenix.ag does not have a practice area? or does it?

Yes they do. Just enter the live dealt game and select "FUN" instead of "REAL" and you'll be on the same live money table only playing for fun money. The next obvious question is "are they really the same table"? Yes, just log into the "REAL" table on another computer and play both of them. Identical.

2. Did you set up any separate email adresses or bank/credit accounts to use specifically for that site?

I didn't but you can if you want to. If you use another email address, make sure it's valid and will not go away soon. The email address is critical for some reason.

3. Any other "defense mechanisms" that I need to set up?

Start small, play small and get very, very comfortable with your online game before even thinking about moving up in color. Play it for real and don't think it's just another computer game. It's real money in a real game. No "do-overs" when you make a mistake!

MVS

[kramden]

Thank you very much for all your help, MVS.(particularly interesting was not taking any bonus money--I would have never thought about refusing it)

I will process the info and take the next step.

Hey one more ?, I read that you have a choice of live tables simultaneously at betphoenix when you go online? Is that correct or did I misunderstand?(combo question:I would assume that we will always see a live game with a visible dealer?)

Keep winning man!!!

Kramden

[MVSeahog]

Hey one more ?, I read that you have a choice of live tables simultaneously at betphoenix when you go online? Is that correct or did I misunderstand?(combo question:I would assume that we will always see a live game with a visible dealer?)

Keep winning man!!!

Kramden

Perhaps I didn't state that quite correctly.

At BPH, during some times of the day and night, they have three tables running. All three are the same table but with different wagering limits. Obviously I'm on the small limits table and not the $500 min bet table!

With that said, if you have a second computer in the room, you can log in on both of them, one using real money and one using fun money and both computers will be on the same table.

Is that clearer?

MVS

[Guest]

I might add that Bet Phoenix has never given us any cause for alarm that I know of.

[MVSeahog]

I might add that Bet Phoenix has never given us any cause for alarm that I know of.

Chief,

Rest assured that if I ever see anything "funny" going on at BPH, this forum will be the first to know for sure!

We do have a few of our "regular" members here who also play there and we do keep a good eye out for what's happening and pretty much anytime they change anything.

MVS (si omnes, S40, sine metu)

[kramden]

Perhaps I didn't state that quite correctly.

At BPH, during some times of the day and night, they have three tables running. All three are the same table but with different wagering limits. Obviously I'm on the small limits table and not the $500 min bet table!

Is that clearer?

MVS

No MVS, I meant that I read in an old post somewhere that you check the tables sometimes to see if any have a bias when you turn on the computer. At least that is what I remember, and it was on a different thread or site. So I took it as there were more than 1 table at a time going. But, I could have remembered it incorrectly.

Your explanation now is clear.

Thanks!!

[MVSeahog]

No MVS, I meant that I read in an old post somewhere that you check the tables sometimes to see if any have a bias when you turn on the computer. At least that is what I remember, and it was on a different thread or site. So I took it as there were more than 1 table at a time going. But, I could have remembered it incorrectly.

Your explanation now is clear.

Thanks!!

Aha, now it makes sense!

Yes, when I'm sitting here at the desk, watching Star Trek or something and I click on to the BPH site, if I see what appears to be a really good S40 (or F3) shoe, I can jump in mid-shoe, make a few wins and drop out.

A lot of times that's all I can really put into the shoe with the available time.

MVS

[Guest]

It is clear to me over the years that the casinos that present a fair game are the casinos that prevail while the casinos that openly cheat eventually fail and close. I'm thinking it will be much the same online.

The Isle of Capri in Tunica is a good example. The employees began cheating the casino en masse causing the casino to go broke. When interviewed later about why they stole from the casino a spokesman for the employees was asked why they stole from their own employer causing him to go broke. He said look, they taught us how and made us steal from the public to make the casino rich. We got nothing in return for our efforts so it only seemed right to steal from the casino. They taught us how.

The Isle was very obvious in their cheating with amateur stuff like removing the Aces from BJ games.

The Minnesota casinos were much smarter. They replaced a few tens with a few sixes.

This is very obvious to a very experienced BJ player like me. I knew the first shoe I played. I was playing in front of a very large crowd so I started counting 6's out loud, very loud. So the crowd started couting with me. You could hear us throughout the entire casino. By the time we got to 37 in a six deck game the Casino MGR was there with all his henchmen. But there wasn't a darn thing they could do. I heard they decided to go straight after that horrible night.

[MVSeahog]

All,

Anybody play the 2pm shoe this afternoon? I stumbled into it just as she was finishing the shuffle so I thought I'd watch a bit. Started out BPB so I jumped in on S40.

Of course, true to my usual play, S40 collapsed almost immediately () but not to fear, the streaks were pointing at F2/F3 so that's where I went and it came out nicely. (+13)

If anyone would like the played shoe posted, I'll scan it but for now, here's the full shoe.

The dealer pulled the "joker" card during the last hand but never dealt the final hand. I hate it when they do that.

MVS

Bet Phoenix 12-15-12 2PM or so

B11232533

B1512113141

B34222142

P11211111

[Guest]

MVS, good thinking and congrats on pulling out a good win on a very tough shoe!

Had you played OTB4L M2 starting at play 3 and then switched to M3 after the first 4 iar right to the NOR manual third bet rule except U1D2, you hit +30 in the last col. and finish at + 29 with a highest bet of 4.

Which, of course, makes me the best Monday morning quarterback in the world and it's only Sunday!

Edited December 16, 2012 by Guest

[moneybac]

since this is about online casinos,i guess this would be great to put this here,i got an email from bogarts casino,same owners as betphoenix,and they of course take us players real money,so i signed up,anyways,i got this brainstorm,what would happen if i hooked up to betphoenix and bogart at the same time,with my wireless,and my pc,so tonight i did it,no, no different's in time,darn it,same games at the same exact time,same dealer,and same crap music,so i played both games at the same time,made a few mistakes at first,bet on the wrong side on both computers,then the wireless,it would say no bet sometimes,dealer was dealing,mean while she's just sitting there,this was after i went over to other computer and place a bet,that was good,got on a good OTB4L run,got ahead on both computers,then stopped as it was at the end of the shoe,it kept going ,so jumped back in ,then of course the joker came out,but won that hand on both computers,then stopped,your thinking this is crazy,but what if this made you a better player at spotting things in an instance with your right brain,when you went back to playing on 1 computer or in a casino with paper using your left brain,but still using your right brain to cross over in an instance,would that make a differents,i just wonder,what a workout on the brain,you can't use paper,no time,so if you just want to play with out paper and you think you got this down pat,give it a try,what the hell have you got to lose,you might like it,better to get in shape here than in that brick an mortar place and cheaper,then of course you can keep the casino's honest as you have both games in front of you,that will give you more confidence,as the one computer would say i put my bet down late while she was dealing,but the 2nd computer never said that,it could be because of the wireless or router is slower i guess,then you can bet oppisite the other computer if things are falling apart,to experiment,lots of room here to play,just a thought