Worth at least $50K

[Pando]

Great start Kevin, thanks.

I am sure you will get all the help you need from the great gals and guys (including me) in THIS forum

regards Pando

[kachatz1]

Appreciate all your help, P

I know you are a long-time player...

My whole objective is to give others, less experience more tools so they can accelerate their learning curve...not spend years " losing" and " giving up"

I actually have zero expectation/knowledge of what I want this to look like of how a new system we " collectively" do this...BUT, I DO KNOW , we'll get it...!!

[kachatz1]

I recognize my approach to " all business" ( only) is lacking ( BTW, it's on purpose) , but one thing is for certain, if I can get even just a few players to really understand HOW TO WIN, it is well worth it to all of us to " put our heads together" and show what a team-effort can result in!

Thinking anyone who truly puts forth an effort will get something really valuable out of this...but if somebody looking for what's after  " sliced bread" , they are going to be very disappointed...ultimately, knowing that THEY did not participate in this, they will just toss it into their own ( ever growing ) pile of what doesn't work...

SAD ?

Yeah , but I cannot " legislate participation" 

               - And, that they will not even comprehend " our collective playing methodology"?? 

 

Sorry...

 

( not our problem...)

 

Edited August 29, 2017 by kachatz1

[wolfat]

Great K,

I was really curious of how we can turn all this stuff (and much more) into something worthwhile but I'm here 

to give my contribution. 

Every long path starts with a little step...

A

[LOU30]

12 hours ago, kachatz1 said:

." Who are those guys?"

Immediately recognizable, my all time favorite.  

[LOU30]

At the moment one of my favorite plays is multi's v singles for playing P & B as separates, I think it would be good to introduce any newbies to the concept if the are unaware of it.

Obviously,

Singles

Multi's  & What are they doing?

Second Liners

MC

LC

SS

Weak side

Not as a system but a game within a game,some thing that they should keep a look out for. 

[Wendel]

31 minutes ago, LOU30 said:

At the moment one of my favorite plays is multi's v singles for playing P & B as separates, I think it would be good to introduce any newbies to the concept if the are unaware of it.

Obviously,

Singles

Multi's  & What are they doing?

Second Liners

MC

LC

SS

Weak side

Not as a system but a game within a game,some thing that they should keep a look out for. 

Hi Lou,

I am very interested in how you are playing "multi's v singles for playing P & B as separates'.

Could you please give a brief explanation on how you are playing it.

i have been playing with using the previous event(s) on each side to try and predict what will happen 

after an opposite. i.e. will the current event remain a single or become a multiple ?

Thanks. 

Edited August 29, 2017 by Wendel

[RickK]

Kevin, Welcome back...

I think there is more to your "HOW TO WIN" comment than meets the eye...(and I'm pretty sure that's why you mentioned it).. many of us can understand the various individual methods explained in the forum, but it takes more than one idea to be able to win consistently  ( I think )....the only analogy I can think of at the moment is a baseball pitcher...many pitchers know how to throw the individual pitches, but the great ones know when, where, and how fast (or slow) to throw to specific batters in specific game situations......(pitches=methods, batters/situations =shoes)....

And each of  the great players on this forum have more than likely had their "Ah-ha" moment  or have "seen the light go on"  that helped them put it all together.....those that haven't ( me for example) are still searching...it's not that we're not trying...we just haven't experienced that "click" that turns it on for us and it sounds like that's what you might be helping us to do...sorry for the rambling..I may be way off base...just trying to "participate"..

Btw..."those guys" would be Joe LeFors  and Lord Baltimore..

[LOU30]

6 hours ago, Wendel said:

Hi Lou,

I am very interested in how you are playing "multi's v singles for playing P & B as separates'.

Could you please give a brief explanation on how you are playing it.

i have been playing with using the previous event(s) on each side to try and predict what will happen 

after an opposite. i.e. will the current event remain a single or become a multiple ?

Thanks. 

Hi Wendel.

 

I think most player’s will agree with me  but as with everything there are different opinions in what way to approach this method and then there is how YOU would play this method.( basically it is each to their own)

 

That said what I meant “by a game within a game”  is... This is not my main approach to my game I am playing a FTS method of all the main goto approaches S40, OTB4L,RD1,SS etc. Now whilst waiting for certain triggers if you track both PLAYER & BANKER separately for multi’s and singles you can find betting opportunities that fit in to sequences that you might miss when waiting for certain trigger points, which will enable you pick up some extra units you might otherwise of missed.

 

Some patterns state the obvious as in this SS example

 

Here you could make your 2 x loses back playing PLAYER 2's LC & 3's MC after the  SS run.

 

And with others you could find an extra betting opportunity as with this S40 example:

2 X loses @ #38 & #39

1 x extra Win @ #41 betting the BANKER stays a single, then back on to S40 @ #44 betting BANKER stays a single again or continuing S40.

 

There are different approach’s or people use different triggers and also depends on what kind of progression you are using, in this example we have a mix of PLAYER sequences as in a 2,4,1 & 3iar which could force a 2 x loss in some betting systems. Or if you were not sure which system to play you could simply bet on the BANKER multi’s in the 1 goto 2’s

 

 

In this last example:

You can see that there is no 2’s in the shoe until play #58, so playing just PLAYER side from #33 you could cash in on 2’s LC & 3,’s MC until your first loss then switch to playing just BANKER side 1’s stay 1’s with the 4/1 ratio of singles v multi’s on that side for a few more units at plays #57,60 & 62.

 

These are just a few examples as you can see there are many ways in which you can incorporate this into your game, depending on other factors such as skill, progressions, win & stop loss margins for both betting sequences and the shoe plus your own general approach of how you play your game!

 

Side note...

( This is just an example of tracking and  playing P & B sides separately for demonstration proposes AND not the overall best way of playing these shoes in the examples for instance we all should know how to tackle shoes with no 2's in them but that is not the point in these examples.)

 

[kachatz1]

6 hours ago, RickK said:

Kevin, Welcome back...

I think there is more to your "HOW TO WIN" comment than meets the eye...(and I'm pretty sure that's why you mentioned it).. many of us can understand the various individual methods explained in the forum, but it takes more than one idea to be able to win consistently  ( I think )....the only analogy I can think of at the moment is a baseball pitcher...many pitchers know how to throw the individual pitches, but the great ones know when, where, and how fast (or slow) to throw to specific batters in specific game situations......(pitches=methods, batters/situations =shoes)....

And each of  the great players on this forum have more than likely had their "Ah-ha" moment  or have "seen the light go on"  that helped them put it all together.....those that haven't ( me for example) are still searching...it's not that we're not trying...we just haven't experienced that "click" that turns it on for us and it sounds like that's what you might be helping us to do...sorry for the rambling..I may be way off base...just trying to "participate"..

Btw..."those guys" would be Joe LeFors  and Lord Baltimore..

Yup. Butch and Sundance had their hands full...

[kachatz1]

4 hours ago, LOU30 said:

Hi Wendel.

 

 

 

I think most player’s will agree with me  but as with everything there are different opinions in what way to approach this method and then there is how YOU would play this method.( basically it is each to their own)

 

 

 

That said what I meant “by a game within a game”  is... This is not my main approach to my game I am playing a FTS method of all the main goto approaches S40, OTB4L,RD1,SS etc. Now whilst waiting for certain triggers if you track both PLAYER & BANKER separately for multi’s and singles you can find betting opportunities that fit in to sequences that you might miss when waiting for certain trigger points, which will enable you pick up some extra units you might otherwise of missed.

 

 

 

Some patterns state the obvious as in this SS example

 

 

 

Here you could make your 2 x loses back playing PLAYER 2's LC & 3's MC after the  SS run.

 

And with others you could find an extra betting opportunity as with this S40 example:

 

 

2 X loses @ #38 & #39

 

1 x extra Win @ #41 betting the BANKER stays a single, then back on to S40 @ #44 betting BANKER stays a single again or continuing S40.

 

 

 

There are different approach’s or people use different triggers and also depends on what kind of progression you are using, in this example we have a mix of PLAYER sequences as in a 2,4,1 & 3iar which could force a 2 x loss in some betting systems. Or if you were not sure which system to play you could simply bet on the BANKER multi’s in the 1 goto 2’s

 

 

 

In this last example:

 

You can see that there is no 2’s in the shoe until play #58, so playing just PLAYER side from #33 you could cash in on 2’s LC & 3,’s MC until your first loss then switch to playing just BANKER side 1’s stay 1’s with the 4/1 ratio of singles v multi’s on that side for a few more units at plays #57,60 & 62.

 

 

 

These are just a few examples as you can see there are many ways in which you can incorporate this into your game, depending on other factors such as skill, progressions, win & stop loss margins for both betting sequences and the shoe plus your own general approach of how you play your game!

 

Side note...

( This is just an example of tracking and  playing P & B sides separately for demonstration proposes AND not the overall best way of playing these shoes in the examples for instance we all should know how to tackle shoes with no 2's in them but that is not the point in these examples.)

 

Great post, Lou.

is this something you use on-line only? ( let me know) 

no matter....this illustrates how much a successful Player in today's world must be able to analyze the " metrics" surrounding today's shoes...

( if they even hope to win consistently...)

[allphar]

Kevin, I use a bet selection as McVince has described as descending events.

(I will not link to it here, as it is in the premium section)

I have tested it on about 200 shoes and the variance is very low. 200 shoes is not much but maybe others can chime in on this.

Two units on this shoe I was on.

I will be working on strengthening it. i.e if there are indications to not place the bet.

Edited August 30, 2017 by allphar

[wolfat]

I suggest a couple of things:

- this thread shouldn't be moved to the premium section?

- kevin should start a new thread. I propose to call it "K PROJECT".

K stays for kevin, that's the promoter

K stays for key to open baccarat doors

what do you think?

A

[wolfat]

Lou, great post!

I actually play Vinsap6 as a base, and mix it with the kind of play you well describe in your post.

I deploy one col for the sap count and two more cols for

Player Single/multiple 

Banker Single/ multiple 

With some practice you will notice some nice patterns .

Sometimes they go straight forward, sometimes ZZ, sometimes appear in groups of two.

On the long run there's no advantage in betting this or that continuously, as the law of figures is perfectly respected, I checked this out ;

but you can get some good plays separating P and B outcomes; consider that each col is long approx 15 decisions, by the end of the shoe, so everything is concentrated in few events. When a pattern holds, you can really clear it up! 

...but need patience in nowhere shoes! don't forget virtual bets after 2 losses iar, they often save your ass in bad shoes!

A

[wolfat]

21 minutes ago, allphar said:

Kevin, I use a bet selection as McVince has described as descending events.

(I will not link to it here, as it is in the premium section)

I have tested it on about 200 shoes and the variance is very low. 200 shoes is not much but maybe others can chime in on this.

Two units on this shoe I was on.

I will be working on strengthening it. i.e if there are indications to not place the bet.

Allphar,

I checked this out in the past, but for me it doesn't give advantage. From my experience (I mean in the casino WHERE I PLAY) it's a 50% bet.

It works well in choppy shoes, with shortage of walls, like this one you presented (3 walls of 2-only- vs 7 singled multiples) but in streaky shoes it's a pain...

Likely in your casino you watch more choppy shoes than me... It needs to adapt to present conditions!

A

[allphar]

Thanks for the feedback wolfat.

[ECD]

3 hours ago, allphar said:

Kevin, I use a bet selection as McVince has described as descending events.

(I will not link to it here, as it is in the premium section)

I have tested it on about 200 shoes and the variance is very low. 200 shoes is not much but maybe others can chime in on this.

Two units on this shoe I was on.

I will be working on strengthening it. i.e if there are indications to not place the bet.

2

I answered this post but transferred it to the Premium section.

[Wendel]

13 hours ago, LOU30 said:

Hi Wendel.

 

 

 

I think most player’s will agree with me  but as with everything there are different opinions in what way to approach this method and then there is how YOU would play this method.( basically it is each to their own)

 

 

 

That said what I meant “by a game within a game”  is... This is not my main approach to my game I am playing a FTS method of all the main goto approaches S40, OTB4L,RD1,SS etc. Now whilst waiting for certain triggers if you track both PLAYER & BANKER separately for multi’s and singles you can find betting opportunities that fit in to sequences that you might miss when waiting for certain trigger points, which will enable you pick up some extra units you might otherwise of missed.

 

 

 

 

 ,

Hi  Lou,

Thank you for all your effort on this reply.It is far more than I expected.(but highly appreciated)

Wendel

[kachatz1]

14 hours ago, wolfat said:

I suggest a couple of things:

- this thread shouldn't be moved to the premium section?

- kevin should start a new thread. I propose to call it "K PROJECT".

K stays for kevin, that's the promoter

K stays for key to open baccarat doors

what do you think?

A

Good Suggestion. I restarted it in Premium Members only forum.

( as to how to move the existing content, I have no clue...)