d0ma1n

Brad01, I see, ok this clear another confusion. thanks. I have a question here, if we have 212211223223 now, we have 3 triggers (red 2). after the first 3s, do we continue with the 2nd & 3rd trigger (which is also the same "to go to 3" as the first trigger) ? Cheers, d0ma1n

Hi Brad01, Thanks for the clear explanation. I need to start practising again as i was away from the forum more than a year. the MDB+ (SAP) i mentioned about is from this sticky thread (Do not post on this thread. MDB Rules) by Ellis. http://www.beatthecasino.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8117 System Selection: (SAP explained) We use SAP to determine which of the 3 MDB systems to play or switch to. I'm going to rename the 3 MDB systems here so that the system's name relates to the SAP counts. S1 (BaS40) is played when 1's are the highest SAP count. S23 (BaOTB4L) is played when either 2s or 3s are the highest SAP count. S4+ (BaS40M1) is played when 4+ (4 or mores) are the highest SAP count. We change systems immediately whenever the highest SAP count changes. This part is where i am confuse as MDB+ (SAP) seems like playing NOR with SAP to me and there is no trigger to look for. Your input ? Thanks. d0ma1n

In your comment, what it mean: "T=3x>=2iar" ??

brad01, Thanks for the excellent chart. Now i can SEE CLEARLY the EVENTS as it is not the same way we chart the SAP as before (by adding up the numbers). Do you mind to share how you play MDB+ now ? Cheers d0ma1n

Hi Ellis, I just purchased the MDB+ manual and going through it. I think i still didn't understand it fully and need some clarification from you. What is the difference between: 1. "MDB+ Rules (5 of a kind) Date: 10/1/14 and 2. MDB+ with SAP Date: 6/4/14 From my reading, MDB+ only bet when we see the "triggers" and MDB+ (with SAP), will start to bet when we confirm the MC events. So, which approach are we using now ? If possible, can you provide a sample shoes because i am a visual leaner. Here are two live online shoes (https://www.m88sb.com/Main/Casino/) P32112113241123431112231311131 P61124432121421111163613 Thanks. d0ma1n

Hi Ellis, I have been following NOR+ these few weeks, and it is very very good approach. THANKS again ! I would like to ask about this shoes: From play #33 to #37, our score drop from +16 to +1 due to 5 iar follow with ZZ, I would like to hear your wise advice on the following options: 1) Do apply cash mgmt here to capture +10 2) It is too risky to go with bet 6 since we are at +1 and if lose this bet will take us to -5 (which means we are game over soon with -8) BTW, I am slowly getting back the drift in baccarat, and mostly I play live online game which have short shoe of less than 60 hands per shoe. Thanks.

I have just finished another session online with NOR, another good winning $7,000 with starting BR of $1,000. Unit size varies: $25, $50, $75. So no doubt on NOR and it is a truly winning Bac system. Anyway, this is not what am going to share in this thread. You can read my experience in thread "NOR Strike Online" in the NOR forum. This session, I did something different, after watching the Vegas video on youtube when Ellis talked about Player Advantage in the 6 shoes in the previous workshop. I should SALUTE Master Ellis in getting the 26% PA. Why ? Coz when I tried to achieve that, it is not easy, and only average half on that between 10-12%. That's the difference with 30 years experiences and 3 years experience (me) :reface: When am striving for 26% PA instead of focusing on +10, +20 Goal, this is some of the finding I think will be beneficial for all : 1. Always keep you in lower bet and rarely go out of the -8u range. 2. Bet less and get more, in other word, the return is better with lower risk. 3. You know how well you really stick with NOR and improve your skill by looking at the 26% Goal. I am not sure if you can monitor this easily through a score card, as I am using an excel sheet since I am playing online, and it is pretty easy for me to key in the unit bet, winning bet, and the PA% is automatic calculated. This is another way to improve my game with less risk, as you can monitor your risk every hand. I have two goals for each shoe now, +10u and PA26%, whichever come first depend on the shoe quality. Roughly I know in order to get there here is the simple formula in mind: Winning Unit / Total Unit Bet = % PA 5 / 19 = 26% 8 / 30 = 26% 10 / 38 = 26% 15 / 57 = 26% 20 / 76 = 26% As you can see here, if you can reach your winning unit goal with less bet, that means your can master NOR inside out, you match the correct system and use the right progression. Maybe Ellis should share his experience more on this. Cheers !

Hi Keith, my youtube id: ytshing Thanks.

Hi TangNang, That is just my expression on the mentality i have. Instead of looking at unit, like stop lose at -8u, I judge my stop lost with the BR I have. If let's say now my BR is $3,000, and am playing at $25, of coz i won't stop at -8 or -9, as I still can wait and deploy another 234. I am still not sure how to put this experience in words here, but the gist of it is the NOR rules never change. Only my betting prog and unit size change according to the quality of the shoe. Of coz winning 4 sessions in a roll we need some "luck" =) lots of it !! And for your first questions, if i lose the 2u OTR bet, and continue to lose more, I will change the shoe ! Coz losing 2 set of prog in a roll tell you something, as the shoe is getting to other direction. My approach really based on experience and it is very subjective. Important you can replay a prog and unit size which you feel comfortable with and you can bet with no stress at all, even you are -18u now, lose your unit, but not your confident.

www.dafa888.com I am from Asia

You can view the page at http://www.beatthecasino.com/forum/content.php?r=1711-NOR-Strike-Online-!!

Thanks Ellis for the great NOR system. Just finish my 4th Session, another $ 5,000 =) The shoes are random, but NOR will put you back in place. Do not rush for big win, nor big lost. Just be consistent and believe in the NOR system. Now what am worry is that I win too much and got banned ! But as long as am not the biggest bettor, i guess will be fine - always under the radar. Waiting for the withdrawal now [ATTACH]2190[/ATTACH]

This approach is adapting the betting strategy to your personal style. The NOR rules still apply, nothing change. And the more you play NOR, the more you know when to use which system on the particular shoe. Next is choosing your prog and unit size which you are comfortable with. That's it !

The bank roll is in $1,000. Searching for the most bias shoe .. and spotted one table which already half way through And for the first 15-20 hands, the shoe is choppy - S40 should kill this shoe, and I know I only have another 15-20 hands to do this. Looking at my initial BR $1,000, I set my target to get $100 from this shoe. Now, deciding my progression, I would play 234 since it is mid-shoe now. Unit size $10. Let's go, start the prog with 2 bet, lost .. it is ok, now go with my 3 bet, Lost ... hhmm .. first half, there is no 4 iar. OK, give in the 4 bet shot ... LOST !! Now my prog is down -9 (BR = $910) .. Critical point, doubt rush in - should I stick with S40 ?? Or change system ? or CHANGE PROGRESSION ? Prog : 234 Unit Size : $20 OK, let's go next bet OTR now .. bet 2 OTR, YES got it ( BR = $950 ), and bet 2 on opposite now .. YES ! (BR = $990 ). A 5 iar, follow with an opposite, and should bet opposite again since the shoe stay that way. But now I should bet 3 instead of staying 2. *Reason because I have won 4 unit (4 x $20=$80), and the next bet of 3, if lose, I still up +1 ($20).* YES ! get it in (BR = $1050). Now, I am up +$50, should slow down my prog back to unit size of $10. Bet 2 opposite now, YES ! (BR = $1070) the shoe goes back to choppy now. Am up +$70 now .. Next bet is 3 bet - as expected, BINGO ! (BR = $1100) .. reach my initial Goal for +$100. Stop and change shoe. _______________________________________________ This is the mentality I play every shoe, set a small goal and with substantial BR (100 unit), you can really exploit every opportunity. My thinking is simple here, if we are ready to lose a prog 123, or 234 .. why not we use the same prog when we are winning. The only tweak that I do is changing the unit size in the prog .. and I find this is easier compare to change system when you are in mid-shoe, as changing system in mid-shoe will not help much as the game is going to finish soon. Remember always set a small goal at every beginning of the shoe. The 123 and 234 prog always keep my betting risk low, and with low risk, I can easily increase my winning possibility by increase the betting unit size. With proper BR, and good discipline, you too can slowly make the consistent winning. =)

Hi All, Just would like to share my experience playing online with NOR. I have played 3 sessions so far at www.dafa888.com, starting with initial BR $1,000, I manage to withdraw out $15,000 (ROI of 1500%!!) from all the 3 sessions. 1st Session : +$6,000 2nd Session : +$4,000 3rd Session : +$5,000 Reason for this winning I believe fall with the progression I used, coz most of the time, instead of switching system, I think the best way is to switch the progression according to shoe quality. I will share more on how I do this later, and I find by doing this, it really adapt to my playing style instead of just following a fix progression. No doubt NOR is great !! Couple with a good Progression Bet, it is undefeatable. NOR System + Good Progression + Good Discipline = Consistent Winning OK, to be continue.

Hi Ellis, Good said from a real Pro ! I think the real NOR player problem is how to stop when winning. How to stop when your confident is rising to the peak. How to stop when your ego is high nose. No doubt NOR is a winning approach, last weekend, i bought in $ 1,000 playing online at Dafabet.com, and won $6,000 (unit size is just $10). This is +600 unit, playing NOR, just play partial in mid-shoe to capture the best "NOR-window-moment", make my +10-20 unit (playing 234) and change shoe. It is pretty easy to reach that when you have +100 as initial bank roll. It is good to have good winning, guess this is my highest unit winning so far with NOR. Luckily I know when to stop and quickly withdraw the winning and left $1,000. As next day, the sudden "Pro" who feel great, ego + confident, increase betting size, and get whack the whole $1,000 in single shoe !! So, it really take discipline and patient to climb the Pro ladder - hope I can reach that level someday. =)

Hi PJ, Thanks for the clear explanation. Definately it is a good concept to bet along with the bias instead of against it. I will re-look this concept with my shoes .. as I feel it is much safer of betting style and yet still yield a strong profit without exposing large capital. $500 to $7500, it is 1400% return of investment !! Where can you get that in the world ??

Hi Papajoe, Very interesting concept. It means you don't bet on every hand, and only bet when you see 1s and 2+ more disparity is clear. The way I interpret it (am only good learner when watching video or diagram), this way is like playing OTBL-0 (mode 0), as you will always bet heavily on the 2 hole, where you will place a heavy bet 4-5 units, then wait, then bet 4-5units (if 2s is MC), am I correct ? If will be good if you have a shoe to explain this, and what is your unit size, betting prog, etc. Cheers

Just finish download and watching the 2nd part of the seminar. Very good stuff and no regret purchasing it (thanks for the kind discount). I can said it is pretty well covered and have a deeper understanding on applying NOR. Thanks to Ellis and those participated in the seminar for the sharing. Glad to really see you guys live and walk the talk, how I wish i can join you all. I am having more confident now to apply it in my play, and even know what to do next when facing a tough shoe where you are in a -7 units position. Last night I played 4 shoee after watching the first part of the seminar and it was really helpful with the temperory stop betting when a 4+ runs hit the shoe, let it end and resume betting when the 1s start to emerge again, and with the right mode, all shoes was a winning shoe, some from -7 swing back to +7. And I am playing NOR couple with SAP as shown by Paul in the seminar, and it really give a double power pack !!

Hi Keith, I noticed there is a special price if purchased both the Video at $ 239.95. I just purchased the first video at $149.95, so if I purchase the next video, do i just need to pay, $ 90 ? If yes, then how can i make the payment to you ? Please advice. Can't wait !!

That's great ! Then let me know once you have adjusted the payment for 25% off. Can't wait to watch the 2nd part ... as the current shoes I am dealing is more on OTBL and F series ... high with 3s and 4s and some normal distribution of 1s and 2s. I am playing online (www.dafa888.com), and they are using 8 decks card, but the shoe is very short, around 40-50 hands per shoe. Cheers

Ellie / Keith, Yes, I agreed with the discount on the 2nd video. 25% I will take it up (as the conversion rate for me is 3.1 over here, so i need to do more saving in order to purchase the 2nd video) I have bought the 1st video, it is very nice to really see Ellis live ! And learning live video is really different from just plain reading. So, let me know if I am eligible for the discount 25% ? Cheers

Hi Keith, HOw much ? Make it affordable to us the old members yah. Cheers d0ma1n

Hi Dave, Great post ! I have been following your post since you came back from the seminar. Don't worry, you are not alone here .. everyone have a bad lousy day in Bac ! If it is smooth sailing all the way, we would not need BTC, coz everyone can be an easy winner. I am not going to comment on your play, but just want to share my experience and something interesting I have read before. I guess to be a long term player in bac, we need to have the following Es (hhmm.. maybe that's why BTC founder start with E as well, Ellis ! ) 1. EXACT - Always know the right system and mode. Always stop when losing first 2 bets. Check the last 8-10 hands, and see what is HAPPENING NOW ! 2. EMOTION - Don't catch your loses. Have a stop lost -8u to -15u (depend on your bankroll) 3. EGO - Put your ego away. Always protect your winning +10u to +15u 4. EXHAUSTED - Always limits your shoe session. For me, is 4-5 shoes per session. Stop and REST ! 5. EXPEDITE - DO NOT play when you have limited time and rushing ( you may lose all your winning in one stupid shoe !) 6. ESTEEM - DO NOT lose confidence when you are in a downswing ( eg: losing 6 in a row and suddenly a 3u chips become very heavy to place on the next bet ) Setting realistic GOALS DO NOT set monetary goal as we have no control over monetary goal. The reason is that when you don't achieve it, your EMOTION will run over you, and you will start making foolish decision. Always set REALISTIC GOAL which can improve your confidence like : i) Improve your hit rate / player advantage ii) Focus on making the right decision in a shoe rather than focus on chasing on your loses Eg: Every shoe I will focus to increase my PA to +10%. If I can maintain that, then will push my goal to 15-20%. Until now, I am still average at 4% (after 27 shoes), to me is consider good as I know I am better than the Fixed Deposit offer by the local bank which is less than 4% and you need to put your money in there for 12-months, and I can do that in 1 shoe ! And last, always have sufficient bankroll. I am playing $30 per unit now. But my initial bankroll is $3,000 which give me a huge buffer when running a bad shoe or session. When I am in a -8u position, I can still choose to restart the shoe with a new prog, or better quit and wait for the next good shoe. But the point is, if you lose -8u or -15u in a shoe, you still have strong bank roll to support your next battle. Again, DO NOT chase your loses, take a good rest, and a good shoe will come back. Hope this will help in your long term play ! All the best Cheers d0ma1n

Ellis, Great sharing as always. Hope you are doing well there ! Nice seminar and can't wait for the video. I just applied ADN to a Live shoe, and couple of observation. Beside the nemesis 212, is there any other dislike of ADN. I got hit to -10u very fast by 231 ( Shoe B1143231131 ) as I enter the shoe at play #11. Maybe you can advice. Full Shoe P1143231131 P1124114114 B311151 I have a downswing of -16u, but amazingly ADN can strike back and end at +7u ( 23u swing !! ) And I see that applying ADN, is like playing TBL. What is the difference ? The only difference is looking at 2s (high or low), and adjust the prog accordingly Cheers, d0ma1n