2 questions on NOR+

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Hi Ellis and crew,

I'm new to the Bac forum but I tried to read as much as possible so I wouldn't ask something that's already been answered 100 times. I couldn't find anything related to what I'm about to ask, so I apologize in advance if I skipped over this info somehow.

Question #1: In regards to the Nor+ enhancements, Ellis says that you need to watch out for 5 iar's and then apply Mode 1 to either straight or zz runs, depending on which run contains 5 or mores iar. But the way I'm seeing it is that you need to be mindful of 3 different run types as opposed to 2: zz's, player straights and banker straights. Is this correct?

For instance, if I'm playing OTBL Mode 3 and so far 3 different banker 6 iar's popped up in the current shoe, BUT the longest player run has been 3 iar, I get that we should start applying Mode 1 to banker straight runs but shouldn't we stick with Mode 3 after losing our 2 bet on a PPP run instead of applying Mode 1 to player runs? Or does the math say that if you are getting 5 iar's on one side, there is a high probability that 5 iar's on the other side are about to come out?

I'll put my next question in a second post.

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Question #2: This might actually be a standard Nor question as opposed to Nor+. Let's say I'm in a perfect S40 Mode 3 shoe and I'm up about 10 units. Out of nowhere, I'm hit with a player run of 8 iar. This is how I played it (the wrong way):

P (win 1)

B (win 1)

P (win 1)

P (lose 1)

P (lose 2)

P (lose 3)

P (win 4 otr and I go right back to betting on opposites/banker)

P (lose 1 - I'm not using u1d2 until I feel more comfortable so I'm back to a 1 bet)

P (lose 2)

P (lose 3)

B (lose 4 - I went on the run with P just as the run ended, losing my second 4 bet)

So what's the correct way to play this? I saw a mention of a "bet on the run, off the run until it ends" technique somewhere so I'm assuming that would be the right play. Can someone please explain how that would work? Do you go back and forth with minimum bets or do you use a progression, etc.

Thanks for all the help!!!

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After losing the third bet in your progression you should switch to mode two for the next time that bet comes up, you stayed in mode 3. Try it again with that change.

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Yes, that makes sense. I stayed in M3 because it was the same run and I was hoping it would end sooner than later. I will try switching modes next time.

Would you also apply the "bet on the run/off the run" trick here, as well? If so, how exactly does it work? Thanks.

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To clarify, the reason I said that ( instead of the same run idea) it that changing from mode 3 to mode 2 after a losing 3 bet gets me out of a losing situation earlier. The run has to go longer to win that way. And 9 iars are rare in choppy shoes

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That is assuming you were playing s40 because it was a choppy shoe

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The on off idea is done in mode 2 ( thereby keeping the bets low) & alternating bets on and off of the run with a separate progression

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Thank you for the clarification. It makes sense.

Can you please give me an example of when you use on the run/off the run and how the separate progressions should be structured? Thanks again.

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Thank you for the clarification. It makes sense.

Can you please give me an example of when you use on the run/off the run and how the separate progressions should be structured? Thanks again.

Sure, when you are seeing many runs at the table you are playing (very common) you are best off to deviate to the On, Off strategy rather than either staying on runs or betting against them. Staying on runs forces a lossing bet at the bottom of the run but the On Off strategy wins the bet after the run half the time while making runs desirable and exploitable while virtually eliminating risk.

Our progression is based on our hit rate in the shoe at hand.

For instance if we are usually hitting (winning) the first bet of a 123 we are best off to exploit that fact by advancing to the 234 and then the 345 to put more emphasis on our first bets while reducing overall risk.

Likewise we advance to U1D1M2 from U1D2 when our hit rate is above 50% and increase our goal from 20 to 30 units.

Betting is all about hit rate. No matter what your hit rate is in a given shoe there is an optimal betting strategy that matches your

hit rate that exploits good situations.

We like to optimize good shoes to make up for inevitable bad shoes. We like to win the most possible in good shoes while losing the least possible in bad shoes. Just common sense, don't you think?

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Thank you Ellis. It's all starting to come together, slowly but surely.

So when you bet on the run, off the run, do you prefer to make it a continuation of the same progression you have been using (lets say U1D2) or would you use a separate "progression within a progression" like bluetri mentioned for this trick? If the latter, how would you structure it? I'm a bit confused about this.

And could you please answer my first question in the thread regrading player and banker runs?

I'm looking forward to the webinar tomorrow. Everything on this forum has been absolute gold so far.

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