Zenwin

How come nobody view this ?? Please be kind enough to comment and help. Zenwin

Hi, congratulation for your success, $$$ !!! O Smile I've 3 questions : 1) When you flat bet as well as watching the game, noticing you always lose at low rounds, and 3-4 low rounds in a row, etc. Is there a way to jog it down at the table, unnoticed ? I know this is rather stupid of me to ask, but being not so experienced, I have no idea how to handle so many details at the same time ? 2) As the above. Did the next shoe come back also with 3-4 low rounds in a row, after the wash ? 3) When you played your extra/sacrifice hand, were they of equal money bet ? (Some casino obliges equal bet on extra spot, so you can't play one min. and the other max.) Zenwin.

Hi, Keith, Thank you of taking time to reply. I appreciate that greatly. I'm making up a pattern (from majority of time I see) as follows: 8 9 7 Q 10 5 6 (presume these are 7 players' 1st card) then J (dealer's up), 2 4 10 K 7 9 2 (these are 7 players' 2nd card). When you see them in one shot: 8 9 7 Q 10 5 6 J 2 4 10 K 7 9 2, (next is the hole card). Is the above pattern random ?? If not, what pattern is it ? For me, I see 10 follows 10, Hi follows Hi, L follows L (although they stop quick or switch direction), it still O.K. to tell once you see a Hi, the next one most likely be Hi, (not zipper) but perhaps not the 3rd card. Do you consider this prediction reliable ? When you said 10 cards you see a low card in predominantly high cards. Do you mean after you see 10 Hi then comes a low ? Or the one low is mixed among the 10 Hi. (Such as 9 8 7 9 2 10 Q 9 8 10 J). I would like to see some illustrated samples, even if they are made up. Zenwin.

Thank you Ellis for this reply. Zenwin.

NBJ said no one can beat the Summer games in AC, does any one know what kind of Summer games they are in Las Vegas ? And in Foxwood / Mohegan Sun ? Some suggestions perhaps ? Where I play it is always a struggle. I had played in the above places, but I didn't learn NBJ then. If they are easier to play, due to the Summer season, I may be able to take some time off to check them out. Please advice. Lots of thank. Zenwin.

What does a random pattern and a predominantly High (dirty clumps) pattern look like ?? Can someone illustrate their differences ? It may sound stupid, I think I am confused. Zenwin:o

This evening I witnessed some unreadable shoes. I am not experience enough to classify them. In my mind I kept on saying "Dirty clumps" or "Dealer bias". For example, last card before the hole was a 10, first card that came out was also a 10. Dealer had a 10 up, there were enough (not overly) 10s on the table, we would presume that the hold card was a 10, but it was not. It was a 2. Dealer hit but didn't break. One other round the last card was a 6, the first card that came out was a 3. Dealer had a 10 up. There wasn't much 10s on the table. Players had to hit, some busted. In any case, the hole was a lone 10 !! In one insurance round, the last card was a 10, it was the first 10 after 3 small cards, so wouldn't you think the dealer get the 10 ? No, it was a small card as well. I was glad I wasn't playing. I was only sitting on the chair of the 3rd base watching because I knew the player who was playing 2 spots. I tried to imagine with playing NBJ would it make any difference. The answer is no. It was just so dealer bias, its no matter what you do, you still can't win. For example, 3rd base has 10,6 vs. dealer 10 up. Read: dealer hand is weak (small in the hole) because the first card that came out was small. We won't hit as high cards start running. Then dealer turned over a 3, hit a 7 and made 20 ! These types of round went on and on. Did that player (whom I knew) lose ? Yes, in big time.

Hi Carlos, I am happy and really appreciate your reply. It has taken me this long to reply you because I have a hard time to digest all of the info. at once. I know I'll need more practice before I can read that many things on the table. But please don't give up on me. Zenwin

Thank you Ellis, I've learned a lot from your answer. As in fact, I reread and reread it before I left this morning to play 'off the wash.' This morning I finished with 3 units win (down from 6 units). It was a real battle over 3 shoes. I was on 3rd base (watching if 1st base was doing better than me. No.) Over 70% of my hands were 12-16, the hold cards were quite predictable but not for my hit cards. I made only one mistake, but was deadly for the table. That fact was my hit card anticipation was not correct, the dealer did not get a ten and made 20. I must say I was the only one who won at the table, although it was only 3 units at the time I departed. You're right, They prep. their cards for their advantage. I also answered my own inquiry of the two different 8 deck of cards in play. The one they show open face (in box order) will be played second. They never show the first 8 deck. That was only counted face down, i.e. 52 x 8 times. I bet these were the cards from closing of the table, the night before. Thats that. I hope some of you guys join in and comment. It will be greatly appreciated. Zenwin

Dear Ellis, Am reviewing your NBJ now and surprised to learn (meaning I didn't learn it well) that some successful 'play off the wash' is for 1st base, due to 'wash clumping'. Then was it only by chance I did well playing on 3rd base 'off the wash' ?? (Refer to article I am ecstatic...) Prior to these plays, I had tested my play one morning with the 1st base choice. I never caught 2x10s and most of the time I had stiffs to hit and busted. I tried on 2 tables and they were the same. When I watch the cards, they were not exactly random but never more than 3 H. So I figured since there is a pattern to follow, I'd have more control and better on hit card anticipation. In those winning mornings, I made sure what were the cards liked on the other tables which have just opened to assure myself the 3rd base would be the right choice. Did I do it right or it was just a lucky guess ? By the way, I went this (it is Sunday) morning to watch cards run and try to see if the games were good. They were not good. But how can that be if the tables were just opened, with the same type of wash everyday ? I didn't play as it was crowded plus neither the 1st nor 3rd base players were doing well, no body were doing well! (Mind you, they were all 7 players at each table) Please answer when you have a chance, but no hurry. And THANKS !

I am blessed of having all your supports on my BJ plays. I can't thank you more. Therefore, another early morning, same seat like you've taught me. Today I played 3 shoes. Last 2 were a bit of battle. I MADE ANOTHER 13 UNITS. I left (very satisfied). Dealer also congrats me of "exercise my controls". But I am beat for my plays as the followings: During my plays there came a gentleman who sat on my right. Everyone knows (including the casino) that he is a card counter. I am happy because this is a proof that the casino is not afraid of them, like you've taught us. I am impressed however, there were 2 hands during play, he saw that I had the standing hands, he went to hit his 10,7, got 10, busted (obvious the table were roaring when he did). And soon we found out, if the dealer had caught this first 10, the whole table would lose. It was a small card that came in between the second 10 together that broke the dealer. He had saved me (the table) twice. Another hand I had 7,4 vs. 7 up. Mostly pat hands for this round, but not many 10s. 2 pers. hit, only small cards came out. I felt 10 wasn't going to fall and I wasn't going to double. But just as I was too curious what "his count" told him. (May be after all these small a 10 will be coming). He said very quickly, although not forcefully "I would double". So I did, I got a 3. (Obviously I said to myself, this is shxt,). He said "This is GOOD". I answered, "How can you say this is good !" He pointed, "Just look for yourself". Dealer turned over a 3, made 10 (closed to my hand, which made sense that I should never double). However, his first hit was a 3, and next a 10 that broke him. If I didn't double, I would have hit again to my 17, and lost to the dealer's 20. So, the real result of today should be less units for me. (There were 3 hands I couldn't have won.) Normally I would have been just as satisfied. And now, it has gotten me to think What is THAT he knows to predict these pattern of card falls ? He told me he did the unbalance count, 2 to 9 = +1, all 10s = -2, the Aces he'll keep an eyes on. Then he'd sometime do the 7s count, sometime HL count. He asked me if I would want to learn, I said "No, it would be too much for my little brain." I asked him why he would scarify for the table, by hitting his 17s, but didn't get paid for. (No answer.) He did not do good at this table, that I know for sure. Can you guess ? And right you are, he lost all his very big bets on high count which wasn't coming. I was a true witness of that. However, my intention today was to try the up-as-you-lose system. But I failed to exercise any of it because these strange happenings at the table. I noticed though, I had lost 3 in a row once in of of the shoe. That also made me scared to try. 2 more questions: 1) Are these counts able to predict which card come first ? (He mentioned he also checked what were on the table). I remember as in fact before I study NBJ, sometime when I was the last person who played "NOT double" knowingly I'd hit a small. But it left me only in confusion of how to play next. I often hit again, but got H and busted. If I would have played "double", I had no choice as to stand on my stiff but would see the dealer busted on this H. Can you comment on this ?? "Should we take a second card on a non doubling hand thats not knowing if it's going to hurt or help us ? Or, should we just stand on our stiff." I got some sensible reply such as "Of course, we should hit, since we not double we're betting a 10 won't fall, when we don't make our hand it is giving us a chance to make it up." Yeah, BUT! Judging from the live example of the above description, can you figure out what is going on ? Sorry, I don't recall every hand on the table. 2) I have also noticed that some of the low ten ratio rounds are not necessary dealer favorable once the dealer has a 10 up. For everyone hit and no one bust. When all the Ls are gone, dealer's stiff hand will get busted on the 10 / coming card. This is rather easy to identify because the table is full with player's small cards, 2 x 10s at the most. Can you comment of this ? I know I am inexperienced to bet with the 10 ratio. But wouldn't this offset our theory as to low 10 ratio = dealer favorable. It seems the fine line is on the dealer's up card. Right, or wrong ? I hope that I'm not such a bother. Your reply and I'll assure you a million times, is greatly appreciated. p.s. Please feel free to switch your answer over to the 'Art of doubling' as you wish, even to the private forum, I'll check everywhere. p.p.s. Can casinos read us ? Can they possibly identify who I am and where I play ?

I am more than ecstatic. Thanks and thanks again to you, Ellis. May you be around forever !! I won yesterday !! Yes, I know to some of you guys, 13 units is not at all winning. But to me, this is great. If I can maintain this record until I reach another skill level of play, I'll be very satisfied. For you guys who is wondering what NBJ can teach you in this game. I'll tell you, A LOT. More than you ever think of. And I am not here to advertise NBJ. I just want you to know, it helps me, and so it can help you. Ellis, I follow every advise, be at the casino at the right time. In fact I went earlier so that I could watch what kind of games they were at each opening tables. I waited on the last table that opened and selected my seat for the game which I anticipated. I won many hands which the table won and I won several hands which only I won (by making the dealer break). I played 2-3/4 shoes and left in a sudden because I couldn't take the heat from other players. For I was not playing the table's way but NBJ's way. My very first hand was 10,2 vs. 6 up. Everyone stood on their stiffs except one needed to double on his 5,4 and got a 6. Something told me to hit because I couldn't break on my 12 and dealer's hand was strong. One older man (BTW, there was only older men at my table) immediately shouted at me, "Hey, its a 6". I was too shy to hit, against the table....(what if I made a misjudgment). So there came another 6 which made her 6,7,6 that killed everyone of us. No one said anything but from then on I decided I'd play NBJ's way, another wise, no way. I am very happy and grateful of everything I've learnt. I am still very inexperienced. Especially in capturing the ten ratio betting in the shoe. I just don't know when is the right time. But all in all, I am happy and hope you guys will let me know your experiences with NBJ. Zenwin

Thank you Ellis. I am enlightened. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to Every Member !!

It makes a lot of sense to me now. I thank you. !

But how do you know any game (of how many H and L rounds) before play ?? Do you need to watch or play the entire previous shoe to know this ?? If not, how many hands do you need to watch before you can determine / anticipate the next round ? And the rest of rounds ? Suppose you've watched 2, 3 rounds and decided the cards run randomly. Is it safe to presume the rest of the shoe are consisted of random rounds except a few H / L rounds here and there ? Is there a mathematic way to better understanding this. i.e. X no. of rounds in a shoe minus the 2, 3 random rounds, therefore the rest of shoe = ?? Please don't mind my slow learning ability. I need a better understanding of this. Thanks.

I am a little confused as to how we'll use this 10s ratio with betting. Let's suppose there is already 2 low rounds gone by, can we safely presume that the next round will (or just may) be high 10 ratio round ? Do we have to trace back to the last shoe we've played, i.e. when there was 2 low rounds, it always followed with a high round ? I appreciate Very Much that you encourage us not to count them. For there really is enough of things to watch (for us beginners) on the game table. Can you explain a little further of how we can use this important 10 ratio count information ? Yes, I fully understand if there are lots of high in one sector, there must be lots of low somewhere. But where ? (in this shoe) Do we have to be an experienced player to know ?

There is a bad weather warning today, that people should stay home if they don't need to drive their cars around. It didn't register until I was 3/4 way to our casino. With today's weather you can't even see the casino until you get near. But I had my mind set on watching them to start the table. Well, they had started some. But they weren't 100% full so they were not going to start more. This is the first time I see our casino like this- "under the weather". I mean, it is the opposite of full. Since I couldn't watch any wash, so I just watched card play. I saw one table that they had lowered their min. to $10 and only with 4 players. ( It would be 5, if included myself.) I immediately rushed over to watch their cards. There was a significant pattern, such as HHHLLLNN.. 1st base was taken but I didn't see him catching any 1st ten. Since I am not thorough with NBJ and haven't started my home practice, I was a little skeptical. On the other hand, I've been watching our games long enough to notice small clumps like these. I decided that I'd grab the 3rd base chair and watch one more hand before I started to play. I lost 2 hands (in fact 2 hands was left in that shoe) but I gathered that was because I entered into play. So this 'red' shoe ended and the next 'blue' shoe came. I held on to my '3 lost in a row and I'll be out' principle to play this shoe. I did very well with the NBJ concept (I say concept only because I haven't started my home practice). I ended up recovered my first lost plus winning 6 units over (by flat betting, because I was not yet familiar with prog.) I left the table with 4 because I lost 2 class B hands before quitting. There were, however, I won 2 decision hands which I think it was worthwhile mentioning. 1) I got 7 and 4, vs. dealer's 8 up. I think her hold card was a random but wasn't a 10. Everyone hit and I perceived that High runs was finished (they ran only 4 times max.) The 2 persons on my right got Low cards, and when my turn came up, I wasn't going to double like everyone suggested in this table. I got an Ace, I know I'd have to hit again, came another Ace. Somehow I felt this Low runs was finished so I Stand. (In our casino, no one is going to yell at me not hitting as most of the time 10 follows an Ace are common). And dealer turned her card over it was a 7 (made her hand 15), she flipped a hit card, it was a 10 which broke her. Will NBJ players double on this hand ?? The outcome wouldn't change as she will break 15+A+10 anyway if I doubled. 2) I think this has to be the best hand I've ever played, with the NBJ I've learnt. I got 5 and 4 vs. dealer's 6 up. Everyone was standing on their stiffs except 2 pat hands. So I was the only one needed to hit (or double. But no way, since I didn't have any clue on her hold card and no other hit card was in sight. The 2 persons on my right had Lows for their 2nd cards that made her hold card more unknown.) In any case I needed to hit because of this 5+4=9, and I got a 3, which made me 12. You should see my hand was up in mid air, wanting to hit and then I fold all my fingers. Then I contemplated a little second and did it once more. I looked over the table where I only saw the facial expression on the 1st base player. He seemed agitated, liked why did I need even to think, 'stand on all 12s vs. 6' !! But I was sure that Low was still on the run, I was afraid only is to hit against the table's way of playing. (The BS everyone plays). But I immediately thought of, it was best for me to get another Low instead of her. I could only break on 9 & 10 and these were not the cards which I'd hit. So I hit, it was a 6 which made me 18. The whole table was relieved and they were more so to see her hold card was a 7 (+6=13). She hit and got a bust card 9 then everyone was really happy. Even the dealer was applauded, said 'What a good decision'. If its not the NBJ manual, I would not have played my hand this way. Although I have doubt about the old Basic Strategy which doesn't always work, but that was the only book that we counted on, until the NBJ manual shows me new light. I still need to know how to set up my deck for home practice (please refer to NBJ private forum). And yes, Carlos, you have explained to me quite detailedly of how to hand shuffle but where I am, we don't hand shuffle cards, we just use the shuffle machines. Thanks again in reading this and offer your helps.

Dear Ellis, Thank you one more time for your prompt reply. I have still the same question. As our games are dealt with the alternate red and blue shoe. When you said Once we sit down, (captured the chair) we wait for the next shoe. Simply say to the dealer: "I'll wait for the next shoe.".... Disregard if I'd play immediately, or just watch the cards, the fact remains when the next shoe comes, it isn't the same games as I've watched and selected to sit down for ? Or, will it be just as good ? Often times I watched these shoe games in our casino; Suppose its the red shoe which is running good with a lot of wining activities, table is already full. (I can't say I know the reasons, i.e. tens ratio etc.) But when the next, blue shoe, comes in play, often its just the opposite. Sometime it is so bad that most players leave before the shoe finished. In such a case, since there are empty seats available, (again, I didn't know about this 1st and 3rd base play) should we sit down in this shoe and play?? Once I had deliberately waited for the wining (red) shoe to come back to see how it did. (It was a long wait because the blue shoe was laborious and with fewer players). Unfortunately, I couldn't prove any point because the number of players had changed (from full table down to 5), I noticed the shoe wasn't good, at least at the beginning. Since most players had lost in this game, I decided that I wouldn't want to be another victim. Should I at least have tried to play ? Your manual is so true ! I am exactly the one you described. The one who play the least and win 90% of the time. No wonder I don't make money like those who play often and win half of the time. Thank you, Ellis. I know that I'm overly analytical (yet not as smart as to figure things out on my own), I will be skeptical to try to play some of these games, without the know hows there'll be just too much tears and wears. Therefore your help and Carlos' help will be greatly appreciated. Oh, one more thing, about the way she prepares those decks differently at the opening of tables. Does it have something to do with setting them up so they'll produce different kinds of game later ? Sincerely, Zenwin.

Dear Ellis, Carlos, Thank you for your prompt replies. I'll use the Private BJ forum to post more questions from now on. I'm happy that I'm included there. I understand that the publics can be benefit from these questions and answers. For example, I had read this forum for almost 4 weeks solid before I purchased the NBJ manual. Yes, I was a little concern about who is reading, out there in the open... I believe you don't hide any secret in BJ, but at the same time, not wanting to broadcast it. Thats why I didn't mention where I play. It isn't a secret. But as I believe our casino has always taken great measure to handicap us. I don't want them to suspect that someone is out there getting ready to play them. Our games are pretty readable, its just that I don't know how to beat them. I know by learning with the manual(s) and home practicing, I'll able to do that one day. Zenwin.

Hello, dear all BJ experts, I am a new member and have just purchased the NBJ manual. I have only read it half but can't wait to finish it. I know it is going to take time to understand it fully. But its really worthwhile. I know its not the time to start my home practice yet since I haven't finished this manual. However, I am going to tell you about our casino BJ playing conditions here. Perhaps by the time I finish my reading, some of you experts will answer and guide me to set up a 'correct simulation' for my next step, home practice. We have about 30 BJ tables (not counting the high stake area). Half of them are in constant play. The lowest table min. is $15, and these table are full most of the time. In crowded evenings and weekends, they'll gradually open the rest of the tables. That is, making sure each of them will be full first. We play only machine (Shuffle Master MD 1.1) shuffled, alternate the red and blue cards, 8 deck games here. It seems they prepare their 2 card decks differently to open each table: I never have the chance to see if the procedure in the beginning is the same with their first 8 deck, as each time I pass by she is already into the process of re-laying cards out, which is putting each 10 cards in 5 rows (north to south direction), face down, and the remainder 2 in the 6th row. Once she finishes with one deck, she'll put it away and does the same with others. Gradually she stacks 7 decks on top of the first, in a zig zag manner. She'll proceed to straighten them out and put them into the shuffle machine, to be shuffled and waiting to be played first. Meanwhile, she displays the next 8 deck, (in their box order). She'll roll them over, wash them face down, pick them back up, (no shuffling is applied). But for this 8 deck, she'll not re-lay them as the first 8 deck. Instead she'll fan them out, flat on the table, collect and put them in the machine, (right after she has drawn the first 8 deck cards out.) Could you tell me from these 2 ways of preparation, would they possibly produce different kind of games ? Random or clumped ? And when time comes for me to prepare my 8 deck of cards to practice, do I wash and apply some hand shuffles ? (What kind of shuffle is close to machine shuffle ?) Or it doesn't matter how so long they'll show up clumps eventually, after about 12 shoes of play ? Should I start up with 6 or 7 players ? Or 5 ? (Since it should not be more than 5 players in real casino play.) And how should I shuffle at each shoe end to duplicate the simulation of "authentic machine shuffle" ? I've also read the last chapter- skill level 7, about TRB and the different game types. (I know , I know, I shouldn't jump like this but I'm too curious.) Would any of you who plays these alternate shoe games please tell me how you'd go about determining the game types you are playing ? I notice that each red / blue shoe has its own profile. Is it necessary to play out these entire 2 shoes to know ? (Then how large a bank roll we will need in such a case ?) Will the characteristic of an identified game type be recognizable in the next shoe after machine shuffled ? Or will it change and its characteristic lose during machine shuffling ? (I know I have a lot of questions.) I thank you in advance for taking time to read this letter and reply me. Sincerely, Zenwin