# How hard is it to get random cards?

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There was always much debate over whether the cards are random in the casino. Of course the card clump players ( NBJ) always contended that they are non random and have a certain amount of predictability. The card counters always say they are random.

This was an interesting article on how hard it is for a computer to deal truly random cards. Aside from walking into a casino and using your powers of observation to actually see that the cards are obviously non random, simply read how hard it is for a computer to deal random cards.

IF the below is true how can simply shuffling 8 decks of cards make them truly random? Obviously it can't. The article was referenced at

http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/entdev/article.php/616221http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/entdev/article.php/616221

```You can tell the winners and honest players by how many times they admit they lost
not by how many times they say they won.```

Need Information Messenger

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Regarding the argument between clumpers and counters there really is no argument. Both use precisely the same information, the uneven distribution of tens. How the cards got that way is really unimportant. If there were no uneven distribution card counting would not work. Neither would clumping. "Clumping" is just a shorter way of saying "uneven distribution of high cards". The real question is: Which method utilizes the uneven distribution of tens / clumping to the best advantage. I know for a fact from casino experience, thousands of shoes played each way, that clumpers get far more advantage out of the uneven distribution of tens than counters get. It isn't even close. Here are just some of the reasons why:

When the counter gets a high plus count he bets high. All he knows is that the remaining cards are high in tens and he knows exactly how high. But the counter has no idea of where this excess of tens is. He doesn't even know which side of the cut off card they are on. He doesn't know how many high tens desity clumps remain. He assumes that those excess tens are evenly distributed in the remaining cards and bets accordingly. But, in Blackjack, due to the nature of the game, tens are never evenly distributed. Why assume something that is never true? This is pitifully little information to bet hard earned cash on. And what if a high desity tens clump appears right at the start of the deal. Half of all shoes start out with a negative count. That's the only time a player has the advantage, when the count is going DOWN. The counter gets his negative count and bets low right through what may very well be the best part of the shoe. He watches the clumper next to him betting high and winning and dismisses him as "playing incorrectly". Yep, the counters have this incredible saying. "It doesn't matter whether you win or lose as long as you play correctly." That sure lets the card counting book author off the hook doesn't it? But he's the only person who benefits from this faulty and foolish way of thinking. Try telling that to your mortgage holder. "Well, yes, I lost the mortgage money but it doesn't matter, I played correctly." See if he sees any wisdom in your thinking. The true pro is there for one reason and one reason only, TO WIN MONEY! Winning money is the ONLY thing that matters. If you are winning you are playing correcty for that shoe. If you are losing, you aren't.

The clumper is a real world player. He knows how many high tens denity clumps there are in the shoe he is playing. He knows how many low density rounds signal high tens in the next round. He knows how clean or dirty the clumps are. He will bet high far less often but will be right far more often. He knows that the dealer break rate is never 28% and that it is dictated by the severity of clumping. One is a function of the other. He knows when to insure and he does insure when his odds are better than 50% and they often are, making that the best bet in the casino. Counters are taught that insurring is a sucker bet. Yet you often see clumpers insurring the whole table and winning. The clumper reacts to where the tens actually are. The counter reacts to where the tens might be. The counter does all that work in an attempt to achieve a 0.5% player advantage. A clumper would call 0.5% a bad day. He works to achieve a double digit player advantage. I played full time in AC for three years without a losing day. Do you think I could do that with a 0.5 % advantage. Would you buy a stock that had a 0.5% return history. What the hell are you counters thinking? How did you get so brain washed. Stop beating your head against that brick wall. Learn NBJ. I know thousands of card counters that quit and became clumpers. I don't know a single clumper that became a counter.

E Clifton Davis

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Once again we find the clumpers club who look to pollute the standard blackjack train of thought with non random BS. When are you going to play the game ?

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When am I going to play? I've already played full time. Before you try learning to count you should focus your efforts on learning to read. Look, if the cards in BJ were random highs would follow highs more often than they mathematically should half the time and the reverse half the time. But that isn't what happens. It always goes one way. Highs always follow highs more than they should. That ain't random. All you need to do to prove this to yourself is count highs following highs. You can count, right?

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Ahh now you had to make it personal can I count come on. Why do you guy get so defensive when we simply disagree? But my point is simply walking into a casino and observing a table for an evening doesn't count as proof. How much money have you won and prove it. Produce other players who say the same thing.. We have hundreds if not thousands of Card counters who are barred from casinos.

~andrew

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I am a long time player and I agree that it does seem that when playing a single deck at home it is not the same as playing in a casino. The theroy doesn't scale well to the casino as the impossible seems to occur in the casino more often than it should.

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Sorry, I see now that you are really green. Everybody that's anybody in B.J. knows my play record. I've done countless public demonstrations with large galleries in casinos in A.C., Vegas, Tunica, MN. Colorado, and the Bahamas. Even the Canary Islands. When somebody said it was just good luck when I did Taj 1 winning \$10,000 in less than an hour with a seldom used high bet of 3 black units and a min. bet of 1 black, I repeated the performance two weeks later again in front of a large gallery. Yep, \$10,000 again in less than an hour. Got any card counters that can do that? I've known thousands of card counters but never knew one that could even make expenses. My advice to you is to go watch them play. Make them put their money where their mouth is. You won't get any takers. What's that tell ya?

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Good observation! Sign of a good player! A good player observes and reacts to what IS happening. He isn't blinded by what's supposed to happen. Players who are brain washed into thinking that abnormalities are just Standard Deviation are doomed to live in a world of standard deviation, ie. a world of shit.

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To answer your question Ken Uston documented wins like that in Million Dollar Blackjack. I certainly believe he was telling the truth as he was the most talked about Blackjack player of this century.

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Well I'll say this as a real player in AC for years. I don't know these guys who own this forum but until you played in AC you have no idea how hard it is to win at Blackjack. I'll tell you one thing I know for sure the cards in the blackjack games are not random as they say. There are endless runs of low cards and I have learned that to never double with an 10 or 11 as I always receive a low card on it. You can sit for hours upon hours and watch 10 and 12 low cards in a row. This has to have a negative impact on Basic Strategy. As an Avid Ken Uston Fan he even wrote about this in his newsletters.

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