SteveO

Okay, so I think I can play BAS40M1 and BAS40 without too many mistakes and in a mechanical manner and I can wait until I'm at mid shoe or so to start play BUT (and this is big BUT to me), I have some major issues/problems with determining which system to use. I know Ellis has stated above in the rules High 1's or high 1's and 2s = BaS40 High 2s or high 2s and 3s = BaOTB4L High runs either ST or ZZ or both = BaS40M1 SS is still F3 But I can't really tell high 1's and high 2's from high runs ST or ZZ. I'm afraid it's way too subtle for me at this point. Could we maybe get some "training" on how scope out a shoe to use the correct methog?

Thanks Mates! This will help me a lot. FYI to the general public..Don't use my work as an example!

Could someone play and post this shoe? It's shoe No. 1 from the 60 Vegas Shoes PDF B13211241221 P1421111212211 P233121112211 B323 Here is my shot. Note this is my first try with S40M1 and all my initial bets were supposed to only be one unit (other than hand 27)

Hey Ellis, can we get more than one worked shoe to go with each +5 system?

Well I never claimed to be the sharpest tool in the shed. I just didn't see that red 1 at hand 5. I think you've got it but I need to reread the rules. Thanks.

Sorry guys. I have another question and I can't figure this one out on my own. At hand 3 after 2iar we start the secondary progression 0123 with the 0 bet. It loses so now we're looking for all 2iar's to become 3+iar's. Shouldn't the bet at hand 14 be the second bet of our secondary bet progression, a 1, instead of a 0 (betting that this 2iar would go at 3+iar as determined by losing hand 3 with a 0 bet). Or.. Why is the bet at hand 14 a 0 instead of a 1?

Ellis, as of 5-3-2014, 9:31 a.m. EDST, this section is not private. I would assume that this will be fixed as soon as everyone who has paid has sent you their username, real life name and email address(?).

And I am wondering the same thing as Abby N. I sent you (Stephen) a PM and have gotten no response. Could someone please answer us?

Well since you ask. I personally think you are trying to leach information that you have not paid for.

So are you saying that BaS40 is the same as S40M2 but with the secondary betting progression? BaS40 (high 1's on the tote board or high 1's and 2s) (Same as S40 except for your secondary prog.) Objective: +5 units Best to wait for a 2iar to start and about ten plays 1.) Bet a 1,2 up as you lose primary prog on opposites. (You can only lose your primary prog to a 3iar or a 4iar when starting after a 2iar.) 2a) If most of the 3s have gone to 4 start your secondary prog 12358 directly under the 3iar If that 1 bet wins, wait for the run to end and start over. 2b) If it loses start over but after the next 3 your secondary prog is up to a 2 bet. (12358) up as you lose after 3iars. 3.) If most of the 3s so far stayed 3, start your primary prog opposite the 3iar (if that 1 bet wins, start over at 1) 3b) Same as 2b.

Couple of questions please. At hand 6 you bet player, shouldn't this have been under banker (betting the 3iar goes to 4)? At hand 43 you bet banker for the 3iar to go 4 and lost but then you immediately started betting S40 at hand 44. I think this was because the run ended and you went right back to S40 as explained above? BaS40 (high 1's on the tote board or high 1's and 2s) (Same as S40 except for your secondary prog.) Objective: +5 units Best to wait for a 2iar to start and about ten plays 1.) Bet a 1,2 up as you lose primary prog on opposites. (You can only lose your primary prog to a 3iar or a 4iar when starting after a 2iar.) 2a) If most of the 3s have gone to 4 start your secondary prog 12358 directly under the 3iar If that 1 bet wins, wait for the run to end and start over. 2b) If it loses start over but after the next 3 your secondary prog is up to a 2 bet. (12358) up as you lose after 3iars. 3.) If most of the 3s so far stayed 3, start your primary prog opposite the 3iar (if that 1 bet wins, start over at 1) 3b) Same as 2b.

And this isn't even all of the spreadsheet! Vic, at this point I don't know What to bet on so I'm trying to explore all the options out there. I know I couldn't keep this up in the casino but I can keep 3 of the 4 counts on a scorecard at casino speeds right now. What would you recommend we do?

In case anyone is interested, attached is a PDF with all the 4D counts shown (P/B, O/R, O/T, OO/TT). Hey, got it to insert too! Sugar House 4-21-14.pdf

I thought that too and played 3 quick games all flat betting. 2 were winners the third crashed and burned (but a stop loss might have worked)

Rich, are you referencing MVS's play or golfgirl007's play? MVS's does lose to the TT's.

MVS (are you Adulay?) This looks like the way I played it so I think you're correct. Now the catch... Could you replay this with BaS40 and post it?

Please note that I am a newbie so if I'm telling you a story here, someone should jump in and correct me. And regarding the rest of your questions: NOR and NOR+ are designed to be played against biased shoes. The particular bias that exists is usually determined by your review and interpretation of past shoes. 4D is still in development but its focus is to win 5+ units in any shoe where it is played. Again, some observation and interpretation is necessary. I would recommend you take $600 and sign up instead of blowing it at the casino with your progression. You will hit that one game that bites you in the ass sooner or later.

Please note that I am a newbie so if I'm telling you a story here, someone should jump in and correct me. And regarding the rest of your questions: NOR and NOR+ are designed to be played against biased shoes. The particular bias that exists is usually determined by your review and interpretation of past shoes. 4D is still in development but its focus is to win 5+ units in any shoe where it is played. Again, some observation and interpretation is necessary. I would recommend you take $600 and sign up instead of blowing it at the casino with your progression. You will hit that one game that bites you in the ass sooner or later.

http://www.encyclopedia-titanica.org/titanic-passenger-list/

So as I gather it, we're talking about +5 units per shoe for every shoe and we are not talking about an Average of 5 units per shoe(?).

I'm sorry McVince but I've told you about all that I know. If you notice my post count, this in only the second message I've ever posted so I am still an extreme newby/rookie/beginner!

As I am understanding this net bet stuff, you want to bet the bet selection methodology that is giving you the least variance. Least variance is where your bet selection methodology is about equal. For example, in 40 hands of play, Players = 19 and Bankers = 21 (a variance of 2) whereas Streaks = 4 and Chops = 12 (a variance of 8) so you would want to net bet your bet selection of least variance which in this case would be Player and Banker. In this case the shoe and bet betting are telling you the same thing.