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Hi everyone,

I live in Toronto, Canada and I used to play roulette when I go to casinos. I realized that baccarat is the fairest game at the casino.

Before I joined the private forum, I was reading some of the threads regarding baccarat. By doing that, I encountered some names almost every threads. These people were patient and sharing their expertise and helping new members as well as inexperienced members, this is what really drew my attention. Just to mention a few names which popped up in my mind: Ellis, MVS, PJ, Keith, Mark, Andrea, TomM, John, and the list go on and on. Without thinking too much, I signed up with Ellis and Keith to become a full member.

I want to thank again MVS for letting me know that I was in the wrong area for my threads.

Being a full member of this forum, I’m totally committed to this site and listen to any advice given to me and I will practice until I’m comfortable to beat the casino.

No doubt I got some ideas by reading some of the threads published by helpful members but further explanation needed to be clarified:

I do appreciate if anyone can explain the following:

1) LC (least common) and MC (most common). Please give some examples so I can understand exactly the meaning of each one and their usefulness.

2) Please explain the meaning of 1, 2, 3, 4 in the columns below mentioned and also explain in details how to fill out 1, 2, 3, 4 in the columns. Is that information useful and why?

Thank you in advance for your help.

Best regards,

Ferdi

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Hi everyone,

I live in Toronto, Canada and I used to play roulette when I go to casinos. I realized that baccarat is the fairest game at the casino.

Before I joined the private forum, I was reading some of the threads regarding baccarat. By doing that, I encountered some names almost every threads. These people were patient and sharing their expertise and helping new members as well as inexperienced members, this is what really drew my attention. Just to mention a few names which popped up in my mind: Ellis, MVS, PJ, Keith, Mark, Andrea, TomM, John, and the list go on and on. Without thinking too much, I signed up with Ellis and Keith to become a full member.

I want to thank again MVS for letting me know that I was in the wrong area for my threads.

Being a full member of this forum, I’m totally committed to this site and listen to any advice given to me and I will practice until I’m comfortable to beat the casino.

No doubt I got some ideas by reading some of the threads published by helpful members but further explanation needed to be clarified:

I do appreciate if anyone can explain the following:

1) LC (least common) and MC (most common). Please give some examples so I can understand exactly the meaning of each one and their usefulness.

2) Please explain the meaning of 1, 2, 3, 4 in the columns below mentioned and also explain in details how to fill out 1, 2, 3, 4 in the columns. Is that information useful and why?

Thank you in advance for your help.

Best regards,

Ferdi

We track events. 1's in a row (bp) two in row ( BBPP) 3 in a row (BPPPB) etc. There is a frequency of events in a typical 8 deck shoe. on average there are 18 one in a rows,9 two in a rows, 4.5 three in a rows and 2.25 four 0r more in a rows. That's why we have the 1-2-3-4 columns, to track those events. They are weighted. 1's are worth 1, two's are worth 2 etc. So if you have a score such as 9-6-3-4, one's (9) would be MC (most common) and three's (3) would be LC (least common)). We use this information to make decisions on bet placement on how the shoe is playing.

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Hi Sinatra1,

I’m glad that you reply my post. I’m stuck with 9-6-3-4.

If it’s possible to give me an example using the example of my table, and explain that.

By the way, 2’s can be BBP or PPB?

Once again thank you for your time.

Best regards,

Ferdi

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using your example. at hand #12 the SAP chart (1-2-3-4) would read 3-4-0-4. Since there were 3 ones, 2 two's, no threes and one 4 or more. at this point three would be LC and two's and fours tied for MC. at the end of hand #20 it would read 5-8-3-4. providing that the last hand completed that event.

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Hi Sinatra1,

Thank you for the explanation. Since I'm just a newbie, to understand clearer is by looking at examples. I heard that MVS says in order to understand the SAP chart, I should go to SAP forum.

Do you know where I can find it, I went to search I was unable.

Thanks again,

Ferdi

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All,

I swear I'm going to bookmark this particular link and have it available as an instant post!!

Papjoe's excellent explanation of the SAP chart and how to track it can be found here.

http://www.beatthecasino.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5698&p=19664#post19664

In fact, I did just bookmark it as I'm sure the question will eventually come up again multiple times in the new year!

MVS

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All,

I swear I'm going to bookmark this particular link and have it available as an instant post!!

Papjoe's excellent explanation of the SAP chart and how to track it can be found here.

http://www.beatthecasino.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5698&p=19664#post19664

In fact, I did just bookmark it as I'm sure the question will eventually come up again multiple times in the new year!

MVS

Hmm... Papjoe counts each 4s or more as 4 points, the same as 3s, but in the System 40 manual (pg 7), Ellis counts it as 8 points. So which one should I follow?

Thanks.

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Hmm... Papjoe counts each 4s or more as 4 points, the same as 3s, but in the System 40 manual (pg 7), Ellis counts it as 8 points. So which one should I follow?

Thanks.

One of the things that happens around here is continuing change.

Originally the SAP count was for a completely independent system play and that's why it was counted like the example.

With the recent mixing of SAP with System 40, it was observed that changing the counting of the 3's and 4's was more efficient with the current way to read it.

If you can find some free time, it will be well worth your time and effort to read a lot of the older message traffic and older system threads. There is a wealth of information in there and a lot of it will give you an excellent basis for what is currently at the top of the play list.

A lot of the current system plays (and future ideas) all come from earlier plays. They just keep changing a bit with the times and the casinos.

The SAP count was one of the things I originally just glossed over as I didn't need it at the time and wasn't planning on using it. Once I read that particular message and put it down on paper a few times, a light bulb went off and it became perfectly clear and actually easy to run.

Hope this helps.

MVS

Edited by MVSeahog
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Hi MVS,

I started the forum by going to the wrong side, I think I should go to the private area, instead of the public one. As you mention the forum is so vast, I did not have the guidelines where to look for which is extremely important for any new guys. My intention at the beginning is to read S40 manual frst, but in the reading I encountered things that I do not understand and don't have a clue where to find them. I don't want to bother or I try to minimize to ask the questions, because I don't want people to think of, that I'm kind of lazy and don't want to look for things that I want. Actually this is not the case.

I'm very grateful for your help and anyone else who has the kindness to share their knowledge without any return whatsoever.

Thanks again for the support,

Ferdi

P.S.

I'm gonna start reading the stuff.

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Hi MoneyBac,

Sorry about a dumb question. You're right.

Thanks,

Ferdi

If you don't know the answer, it's not a dumb question.

As long as you got an answer, it's all good!!

Seriously, there is a WEALTH of information in the older threads. Taking notes on a lot of it will pay off later down the line.

Lots of good ideas and plays from some pretty smart players for sure.

Yes, a lot of the information has been pushed to the back of the line, but it all comes back sooner or later, usually updated, modified and played a bit better.

Knowledge is good and every little bit of information helps as you continue along in baccarat.

Don't be too shy about asking questions. They usually help everyone either learn something or review something.

MVS

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Hi MVS,

You really encourage new guys. No doubt you're an asset in this forum.

I've just finished reading SAP chart, but I have two questions, if you don't mind:

a) In the play 40, shouldn't be 9, 18, 7 (four plus three straights), 4.

B) According to sapex1_pg3.jpg, how do you define LC and MC, if you can give me some more details so I can understand.

MVS, I'm getting there with my baby steps.

Again thanks for the help,

Ferdi

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Hi MVS,

I almost forget to ask you. Where I can find the information about 1s, 2s, 3s, 4s.

I read one time, and it explains that 1s = 1 row, 2s = 2 rows, but without giving the examples, it's kind of hard to figure it out. Can you explain or where I can read it.

Thanks,

Ferdi

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