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Hi Mr. Ellis

I am new here, i see that your always there to give an answer so i have some question if you can answer please

I see that NOR is good way of playing and guys have done good job with it but even with it you can have tough time

I am playing online and main problem is lack of bias, shoes mostly keep changing its bias

it goes from strong sided one side to other then to netbeting, its hard to predict where it will be

i beleve that manual is good and that in private forum you can learnd how to play with other guys,but for me thats big money and i am affraid that maybe it will not work on shoes where i am playing.

is there any chance to pay membership after joining to private forum or to get manual to test then to pay it

i see that mdb is for regular cards and that your responsible for it, so if you can give me some better deal for the beginning

or at least explain to me how mdb works just to test it first

thank you !

Ha, well no, we aren't in the habit of giving away manuals for junior (free) members to test. They have already been fully tested and vetted by many qualified experts and we already know that they work and many private members are already making a good living from these manuals.

I am not at all suprised to learn that you are not doing so well with what you have been able to glean from the public forum. Winning is not that easy and you need the skills taught on the private forums. Correct, biases do not always last forever and often change and you need to learn how to cope with that and how to win anyway. That is what the private forums are all about and why people join them.

However, we are starting a new program that will be of interest to you:

Public members will be invited to play on line with us recommending your plays. You are free to play your money however you want and at whatever stakes you want. But down in a corner of your screen we will be telling you how we would play your shoe. You can follow our advice or not, as you choose. But at the end of the shoe you can compare your score to ours. It won't take long for you to see for yourself that you would have been better off to follow our play. Whatever money you win following our play is yours to keep.

Now, of course recognize that we are not going to keep doing this forever. At some point you will be asked to join the private foum. Then, as a private member you can keep following our lead while you are learning how to play.

But it is a way for you to prove to yourself that our play is a whole lot better than your play BEFORE you join the private forum - which is exactly what you were trying to do in the first place. No other site offers such proof. We put our money where our mouth is.

Sound interesting?

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To Siki D Boy,

I can tell you that I have been playing Baccarat for the last 4 years. Mostly losing. I joined Beat the Casino in August this year (2014). When I joined I STOPPED playing baccarat until I read and re-read the Nor manual several times. I practiced and read again. Then I bought MDB. I kept reading and reading and reading all the forum posts. I watched their YouTube videos. There is so much that BTC offers. The membership fee is a drop in the bucket compared to what you can make if you take the time to sit and learn. All the forum members are happy to explain and help out as necessary. For the last 3 weeks I have been playing everyday. I have never had a losing session since I joined. Moreover, I am on my way to a making a 6 digit income. You can do this. It is not hard. Like anything else, the rewards are great but you need to learn the manual and always keep up with it. I'm on the forum everyday and still learning more and more. Your confidence level will skyrocket once you are comfortable with it. BTC is one site you can trust. Good luck.

CT70

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Hi Ellis,

What online site will you be playing at?

Sounds interesting...

It's sounding like the guys want to try 5 dimes first.

I'll practice with it and learn that casino's vulnerabilities.

Then you guys will be free to play along with me. You are free to bet as you wish.

Think of my bet as "recommended" - no guarantees

But my hit rate averages above 50% while most players find a way to average less than 50%.

If you check your own records, I'm pretty sure that will be the case.

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To Siki D Boy,

I can tell you that I have been playing Baccarat for the last 4 years. Mostly losing. I joined Beat the Casino in August this year (2014). When I joined I STOPPED playing baccarat until I read and re-read the Nor manual several times. I practiced and read again. Then I bought MDB. I kept reading and reading and reading all the forum posts. I watched their YouTube videos. There is so much that BTC offers. The membership fee is a drop in the bucket compared to what you can make if you take the time to sit and learn. All the forum members are happy to explain and help out as necessary. For the last 3 weeks I have been playing everyday. I have never had a losing session since I joined. Moreover, I am on my way to a making a 6 digit income. You can do this. It is not hard. Like anything else, the rewards are great but you need to learn the manual and always keep up with it. I'm on the forum everyday and still learning more and more. Your confidence level will skyrocket once you are comfortable with it. BTC is one site you can trust. Good luck.

CT70

Thanks CT70! Among all of our private members, they have tried every site there is. They all say the same thing - that BTC is the best site there is by a country mile.

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Hi Elis,

Just to share my personal opinion on how to convince member to join the private forum. I think you can take two steps. First step is allow members to just purchase the NOR manual (maybe usd 100 or 200), after reading the manual and finding the real power of NOR, i believe many members will proceed to buy the private forum access. When they buy the private forum access, you can deduct the money that they used to purchase the manual from the total usd 600 total cost.

Btw, i am considering to be become a member. As i found it hard to find useful information in public forum. Without the manual i cann't really master NOR,

and i cannot learn from other smart NOR player either

Kevin

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Hi Elis,

Just to share my personal opinion on how to convince member to join the private forum. I think you can take two steps. First step is allow members to just purchase the NOR manual (maybe usd 100 or 200), after reading the manual and finding the real power of NOR, i believe many members will proceed to buy the private forum access. When they buy the private forum access, you can deduct the money that they used to purchase the manual from the total usd 600 total cost.

Btw, i am considering to be become a member. As i found it hard to find useful information in public forum. Without the manual i cann't really master NOR,

and i cannot learn from other smart NOR player either

Kevin

Kevin, I don't think any purchase is deducted. Meaning, you pay for NOR...you get the manual and maybe a few examples.

THen you have to pay for the private forum access. This apparently is where most the learning takes place...

Hopefully Ellis sees this thread, and gives you the exact details.

Good luck if you hope to join.

I am using NOR for bet selection but not wagered amounts.

I've won my last 14 visits to the casino...although it can take 12 to 18 hrs to pull out a profit of 20 units. My variance is much higher ...rather than playing a 1,2,3 NP.

Rarely, do I bet more than 5 units...but when things go poorly, I slowly increase my bets to clear the strings.

Rarely is this game very easy...

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Thanks, Hamster for your reply

I really admire that you can pick up NOR on your own. For me, i find it almost impossible so i have just purchased the NOR membership. Do not want to wasting time in the public forum trying to find some useful tips. Wish you continuous good luck in your subsequent casino visit

Kevin, I don't think any purchase is deducted. Meaning, you pay for NOR...you get the manual and maybe a few examples.

THen you have to pay for the private forum access. This apparently is where most the learning takes place...

Hopefully Ellis sees this thread, and gives you the exact details.

Good luck if you hope to join.

I am using NOR for bet selection but not wagered amounts.

I've won my last 14 visits to the casino...although it can take 12 to 18 hrs to pull out a profit of 20 units. My variance is much higher ...rather than playing a 1,2,3 NP.

Rarely, do I bet more than 5 units...but when things go poorly, I slowly increase my bets to clear the strings.

Rarely is this game very easy...

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Kevin, I don't think any purchase is deducted. Meaning, you pay for NOR...you get the manual and maybe a few examples.

THen you have to pay for the private forum access. This apparently is where most the learning takes place...

Hopefully Ellis sees this thread, and gives you the exact details.

Good luck if you hope to join.

I am using NOR for bet selection but not wagered amounts.

I've won my last 14 visits to the casino...although it can take 12 to 18 hrs to pull out a profit of 20 units. My variance is much higher ...rather than playing a 1,2,3 NP.

Rarely, do I bet more than 5 units...but when things go poorly, I slowly increase my bets to clear the strings.

Rarely is this game very easy...

Hamster I wish you would get the hell off of my forum. You have no idea of what you are talking about and you continuously mislead people making things up as you go.

1.) The NOR membership includes the entire NOR forum - thousands of pages of instruction and examples. You get all of your questions answered. It has always been that way and always will be that way.

2.) It would be pure stupid to increase your unit when you are doing poorly. You increase your unit when you are winning. When you are losing you quit!

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Kevin, I don't think any purchase is deducted. Meaning, you pay for NOR...you get the manual and maybe a few examples.

THen you have to pay for the private forum access. This apparently is where most the learning takes place...

Hamster,

Kindly refrain from speaking about things that you know nothing about.

Luckily Ellis saw your message before I did.

In the future please stick to what you know best.

Your "description" of the Private areas of this forum is woefully incorrect.

MVS

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It's sounding like the guys want to try 5 dimes first.

I'll practice with it and learn that casino's vulnerabilities.

Then you guys will be free to play along with me. You are free to bet as you wish.

Think of my bet as "recommended" - no guarantees

But my hit rate averages above 50% while most players find a way to average less than 50%.

If you check your own records, I'm pretty sure that will be the case.

Hi Ellis,

I'm not too familiar with online casinos. Can you please provide the name of the site and date and time you will be playing? I would like to watch and/or play along.

Thx

CT70

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Hi Ellis,

I'm not too familiar with online casinos. Can you please provide the name of the site and date and time you will be playing? I would like to watch and/or play along.

Thx

CT70

Not just yet CT. Whichever on line casino we pick, we want to study it carefully ourselves first - just as we would a real casino. But we'll let you know.

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BTW guys, Kingstar did in fact join the NOR private forum. Maybe you can get him to come back here and give you a REAL idea of what goes on there. But he'll be pretty busy for a while. There is a LOT to learn.

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Hamster I wish you would get the hell off of my forum. You have no idea of what you are talking about and you continuously mislead people making things up as you go.

1.) The NOR membership includes the entire NOR forum - thousands of pages of instruction and examples. You get all of your questions answered. It has always been that way and always will be that way.

2.) It would be pure stupid to increase your unit when you are doing poorly. You increase your unit when you are winning. When you are losing you quit!

Sorry Ellis...

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BTW guys, Kingstar did in fact join the NOR private forum. Maybe you can get him to come back here and give you a REAL idea of what goes on there. But he'll be pretty busy for a while. There is a LOT to learn.

Master Ellis,

You are right. I have been quite busy for the past few days. I've read many good post in the private forum and think about how i can apply those method into my play while playing the real shoes posted by other members. It has been a great learning experience.

For those guys who are serious about playing baccarat, i will say:

Joining the private forum is just the first step, if you want to really improve your play, you must spend time to learn those method or system designed by Ellis. And practise a lot before entering casino to beat it

Regards,

Kevin

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Right kingstar, nobody can beat this game on their own. Casinos are just too damn smart for that.

Well, OK we occassionally get some really bright guys like hamster here that can glean enough from our public forum here to win overall.

Good for him but what a waste. On the private forum he could really learn to win big time. I guy that smart could quickly learn to be a full time pro as many have already done. He could get back the entire cost of joining in just a few shoes. Then it's clear sailing.

He could learn systems like MDB+ that has the highest win rate, the highest hit rate and the highest PA (Player Advantage (ROI) in the entire history of gambling. A system so simple he could learn it in an hour. PURELY mechanical - no decisions whatsoever. A hundred players would play the same shoe the exact same way. It is very easy for anyone but a guy like Hamster.....

But NO, he lets his own pride get in the way of his own success - An incredibly sad situation.

That guy could be our next millionaire!

But no, he's too chicken. What a waste!

Look, I'm 74 years old and not in good health. I'm paying the price now for many digressions.

I can't keep doing this much longer.

NOW is your chance. Tomorrow - who knows?

One thing is for sure - BTC won't be here much longer.

And, watch my lips, BTC is the ONLY place you can learn how to beat Baccarat - the ONLY place.

After I'm dead, so is winning at Baccarat.

The casinos will have clear sailing.

Yeah, yeah, I know. There are lots of Johnny come lately scammers out there. Yep, for sure! I don't need to name names.

Some are not really scammers - some mean well but are incompetent. Others are pure scammers. It adds up to the same thing either way - you lose.

Most of you have already had your fingers burned. Most of the private members here at BTC are here BECAUSE they got their fingers burned somewhere else. Hell, EVERYWHERE else.

I've been teaching Baccarat for 30+ years.

I was the first Baccarat instructor ever and the best.

I never scammed anyone - not anyone anywhere.

I have produced the only winning players there are in this game.

Most get back their tuition in just a few shoes - some their very first shoe.

But I won't be around much longer.

Now is your chance - your ONLY chance.

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You know, there used to be a site on the internet where a guy bet you $30,000 vs your $3000 (in other words he's giving you 10 to 1 odds)

That your system, whatever it is, cannot beat his computer's 10,000 shoes.

He got a lot of takers but nobody ever won his $30,000. Nobody could beat his computer.

Ha, I used to have a hobby of beating the best Baccarat program of that era - mid '90s, every time.

I'll think of the name of it here in a minute.

So his bet interested me.

So we tried it ourselves against a collection of 10,000 actual casino shoes on our own computer.

Recognize that a computer can only play a purely mechanical system. You can't program guesswork.

So we tried our own system called OTB4L U1D1M2 - which is one of NORs foundation systems we still teach today.

It not only won - it won with an astounding 34% PA (Player Advantage).

To put that in perspective: BJ card counting attempts to achieve a 0.5% PA but never quite makes even that.

In other words we are talking about winning 68 times what a card counter could win on a perfect day.

So, did we ever take him up on his $30,000 bet?

No, the day after we announced our results - his site vanished never to be seen again.

Look, there are ways to beat this game using the casino's own strategy against them.

While simple, you will never discover them on your own - not in 3 lifetimes.

That is what we teach and we are very good at what we do. Best in the whole world.

Yeah we charge a little money to teach you. ALL good teachers do. Anywhere from Calculus Professors like I was to Golf instructors which I wanted to be.

But any devoted student makes that money back in no time. So will you. Ask any private member here.

We start with simple stuff and graduate you up to MDB+ where you can beat nearly every shoe you play.

Yep, you'll lose a shoe now and then but guess what - Your losses are limited to 4 - 6 units. Your winnings meanwhile, are much more.

ANYBODY with sufficient desire can learn this stuff. No math involved. It's just a question of following a few simple rules.

Don't sit there thinking about it. Do it!

Edited by Ellis
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Ellis I'm sure you've heard,"you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink it!" So true.

It's a shame he doesn't want to pay for the information. He has an ego problem and thinks he can do just as well on his own.

I used to be a salesman and sell Lexus cars. Sold them for 13 years. I would get the "mouches" that come in and want to waste my time and pay a lot less than cost. After doing a 30 minute demonstration on the highlight features of the car, I would get them excited enough to commit to buy the car, but I couldn't make much money on them even then. After they signed the purchase documents, I would have to provide a much more detailed explanation of ALL the features the car had. This takes up to 90 minutes if done properly. Afterwards many would say "had I known it had "this and that" I would have paid you more for the car". At that point it was too late. Documents were signed and they were leaving.

The point I'm trying to make is (and you said it the other day) your marketing efforts are not good. I found that the videos you guys have on YouTube are great. That's what got me to join. They made a lot of sense. And they relay enough information and stop just short of letting the cat out of the bag. For example, I was watching one of your videos where you were explaining strategy and you stopped short of talking about modes and what they do. That got me to join your forum because I absolutely needed to learn what those "modes" were and I knew you weren't going to disclose them on youtube for free. I would have to pay for that. So I suggest keeping up with the videos and stopping short of disclosing key information, where the reader will salvate to know more and whip out his credit card. Also, what's wrong with asking all our members to re-watch all the videos you have on Youtube to get view count up high. Because when someone searches for something on Youtube they look for the highest count because that means people had interest in it.

You may also want to look into SEO, (Search Engine Optimization). When people do a google search, your site will come up further up on the first page. I have used this for my existing business and it helps.

Thx

CT70

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