Baccarat Exchange Betting

[Pando]

Hi everyone,

I just found this online, Betfair Exchange Baccarat

Betfair is an Australian licenced betting exchange.

http://games.betfair.com/exchange-baccarat/turbo/ (live site)

http://www.exchange-games.com/what-exchange-baccarat (rules)

The game begins with a round of betting where no cards are yet dealt

for the Player or Banker. At the end of the first round the player and banker

are both dealt a card and the second round of betting commences. At the end

of the second round, the player is dealt a second card and the third round of

betting commences.

The banker is dealt a second card at the end of the third round and the game

will end here if neither the player nor the banker will take another card. This is

determined using the standard drawing rules for Baccarat.

If the player will take a third card, then another round of betting commences

before the card is dealt. If the banker will take a third card, then a further round

of betting commences before the card is dealt.

This house commission is a simple 2%

Options also allow ties, pairs etc.

I did not known this even existed until today

regards

Pando

[brad01]

2% is not that bad.

Hey Pando did you know at my casino all touch games on the main floor all B or P bets lose off ties !?

Has anyone seen this before?

The tables are still packed though?

[Pando]

Hi Brad

No I was not aware of that, and I have not seen it anywhere

I guess as long as the house edge is reasonable it should

not matter how they get it

Paying half on banker 6 seems to be most common

Re the Betfair Exchange it opens so many new opportunities

as you can bet 3 or 4 times during each hand.

I need to do work on this

cheers

Pando

[brad01]

Hi Pando sorry to detract from your subject as I am interested in this betfair thing especially when its Australian run as its in AUD and should be easy to set up account for me but:

If B and P lose off all ties and a banker 6 pays half then its a lot worse odds right?

Don't think I will play that but it concerns me that people are playing it as the casinos get away with it

I will have to check the rules but they don't make it easy to find out.

In 72 hands if a tie happens 1 in 10 then its 7 times per shoe on average

If you flat bet every hand then you will lose on average $70 per shoe while betting $720 under these rules

That's a 10% edge if I am not wrong?

That's terrible

[Pando]

Hi Brad

Sorry if I confused you

I meant that paying half on banker 6 is most common worldwide

In BetFair, as I understand it, you get paid whatever the odds were

when you made the bet. The 2% is deducted from all bets made which

reduces the pool of money. BetFair make their cut that way.

Here is an example today

Before any cards dealt B $1.96, P $2

Then player dealt and 8, banker a King (=0)

New odds B $2.70, P $1.35

Then player got a King to make a natural 8

Banker odds went to $11.30 and Tie was $13.20

Banker got a 7 so player won with Natural 8 over banker 7

You see the odds change with every card dealt, with the draw

rules the same as I have seen anywhere

Of course you can just bet B or P as in a normal game

and hope the decision is correct and leave the bet standing or

you can arbitrage bet on the other side to cover your first bet.

I understand the price quoted is after the 2% deduction on all bets

I think there may be wonderful opportunities here as it seems to me the

odds change way out of line from what I think they should

There are websites with the relative odds of a B or P win depending on

the B and P totals after 2, 3 or 4 cards have been dealt

Cheers

Pando (Paul)

Hi Pando sorry to detract from your subject as I am interested in this betfair thing especially when its Australian run as its in AUD and should be easy to set up account for me but:

If B and P lose off all ties and a banker 6 pays half then its a lot worse odds right?

Don't think I will play that but it concerns me that people are playing it as the casinos get away with it

I will have to check the rules but they don't make it easy to find out.

In 72 hands if a tie happens 1 in 10 then its 7 times per shoe on average

If you flat bet every hand then you will lose on average $70 per shoe while betting $720 under these rules

That's a 10% edge if I am not wrong?

That's terrible

[Fedda]

Interesting, but the most interesting thing must be how the cards are shuffled. Any info on that?

Thanks

[Pando]

This is an RNG

BetFair have no interest in the composition of the shoes as they

get their 2% cut from the total pool

Their statistics page has all previous shoes so you can make a judgement

about whether they are biased or not

I played MDB+ on 2 shoes and won both

regards'

Pando

[brad01]

Hey Pando, no you didn't confuse me I was talking about my casino!

If they take all bets on ties does that not increase their % to 10 % ?

Betfair sounds like they run off commission like most sports betting so it should be fair

You won playing MDB+ ?

I would think you would win a good percentage of al 50/50 games with MDB+ though hey?

I have problems with roulette though sometimes its can be so volatile.

I might try it thanks for sharing the info

[Fedda]

This is an RNG

BetFair have no interest in the composition of the shoes as they

get their 2% cut from the total pool

Their statistics page has all previous shoes so you can make a judgement

about whether they are biased or not

I played MDB+ on 2 shoes and won both

regards'

Pando

Great, I'm gonna check this out because I like the way RNG are in "practice mode" since we all know it's rigged when going live.

Thank you

[casualboarded2]

I checked the betfair link, I don't think its loading on my end.

[Pando]

Hi Brad

No they dont take all bets on ties

You get a refund just as in most real casinos

Thats my understanding anyway

cheers

Pando

Hey Pando, no you didn't confuse me I was talking about my casino!

If they take all bets on ties does that not increase their % to 10 % ?

Betfair sounds like they run off commission like most sports betting so it should be fair

You won playing MDB+ ?

I would think you would win a good percentage of al 50/50 games with MDB+ though hey?

I have problems with roulette though sometimes its can be so volatile.

I might try it thanks for sharing the info

[Pando]

Sorry Brad

Now I have confused myself

Yes if your casino take all bets on ties, that's not acceptable

I simply wouldn't play there

My thinking at Betfair is that if the punters are fixated on scalping,

then their system is set up for that (= super random shoes)

Therefore playing MDB+ should be appropriate, and so far, so good.

I am not playing for money but I believe there is no practice mode on

the website. What you see is the same whether you play for money or not.

I intend to open an account there and see what happens

I will keep you all posted

regards

Pando

[Pando]

Here is a link to their help/FAQ page

http://en.learning.betfair.com/app/answers/subcat-list/p/106

regards

Pando

[brad01]

Well its called Bet Fair so it must be fair !?

I'm thinking sportsbetting sites make their money as you say off commission and 2% with big volume is good so maybe they are just happy for 2% on RNG shoes

With probably less than 0.1% or so of players on there playing MDB+ (Pando's probably the only one!) or similar system that can win (if one exists) then they are pretty safe to get their 2%

[Pando]

Hi Brad

BetFair are huge worldwide

They are basically a UK company but have been licenced in Tasmania, Australia

and other places around the world. Horse racing is/was their core business.

They are a sports book for all major sports, but also have a standard live casino

product (including baccarat).

The Exchange Betting option to which I refer is a world first as far as I know.

Its designed for arbitrage betting (scalping) which means the idea is

that you bet one side in a contest, and then after something happens

(such as a goal in a football game, or the dealer hand gets a 9 in baccarat),

the odds will change. Then you are able to either bet the other side at a

different price than it was originally, thereby making a small profit no matter

what the outcome.

I suspect nobody plays normal baccarat on the site, and so I am hoping that

there may be opportunities there.

BetFair have an excellent reputation, I would not worry about their RNG being

biased. Its not in their interest to manipulate any shoes as they get their commission

on the total pool.

I am still working through the FAQ section but it looks good so far

cheers

Pando

[brad01]

Hear what you are saying which why I also think it would be legit and good opportunity

[brad01]

you know what Pando Aussies are pretty big gamblers!

[Pando]

Now I know there are opportunities here................

One feature of the game on BetFair is that it shows how many

of each card are left in the game.

I just saw a game where there were 8 cards remaining after the

player had a 4 dealt, and the banker had an 8 dealt.

There was only 1 picture or 10 card left, but there were 3 x 4's,

2 x 3's and 2 x 2's.

The only card the banker could improve its hand with was the 10

which would score a natural 8.

Anything else and the player must win.

But the odds for the player hand went UP from $2.02 to $2.36

Player got a 4 (total 8), banker got a 2, game over

Go figure.

regards

Pando

[brad01]

That really doesn't make sense does it

Makes you wonder whether they know what they are doing but they must because there would be consultants setting it up I imagine.

Hey Pando to go back to my casino odds since this thread is sort of about odds and commission etc I asked a dealer for the rules:

Its called 'No Commission Baccarat' and bets lose on ties

BUT

They pay a 3 card natural win double

AND there is no commission charged and banker 6 win pays normal

It seems to be a trick to give you a little but take away more so you end up worse off?

I haven't done the maths but a 3 card natural win would be pretty small % while ties are an expected 1 in 10?

If you lose on all ties then it puts the house edge up to 10%

Would anyone play this?

The frustrating thing is they get away with it because they are the only casino in the state - tables are pretty busy

[markjacks]

Nice Article Pando, I enjoyed it very well! Thumbs up!

[Pando]

Thank you sir

Pando

[brad01]

Hey Pando I joined up to Betfair last night and got a missed call from someone this morning which was a complimentary welcome phone call.

03 number being Melbourne or Tasmania

Wish every retail store has that kind of service!

I want to start following Ruebels baseball picks which Betfair offers as well as most other sports

Also had a look at the Exchange betting

I think it all looks above board and computer generated.

Time will tell with real money betting.

Good how you can see the cards remaining

They also have a 'new' live casino site

I've been blocked due to restrictions but it says if you feel you shouldn't be then contact them which I will be as Australia should have no such restrictions?

[Pando]

Hi Brad

Best of luck with the exchange betting baccarat

Yes I thought it seemed all above board

They have no vested interest in manipulating the shoes

Please let us know how it works for you

I have not looked at their live casino site yet

regards

Pando

[markjacks]

Is anyone still into Baccarat this days? Any tips for a newbie trying to get started?

[Ntrl9]

Hey Mark-

The best tip I can give you is to join the forum.

Ntrl9