CdnChamer

Hey Glen, I know how frustrating the learning curve can be as we were all at the same place as you one time or another. As you practice and then play live, you will continue to learn and believe me, you will make mistakes just as I did and some will be costly, it's all in the learning curve. Study study study, practice, I'm sure you heard it all before. Don't give up, before you know it, you will operate quickly with confidence in due time. A word of caution....you need to also control your confidence as well. It will catch you off guard one day. Hope you do well and keep at it. CC

I treat it as a win and step my bet down as if I won it. And carry on with next hand in sequence. It can be frustrating but at least if it was on the bank, you didn't lose. For me, that's a win. CC

A-W-E-S-O-M-E !!! VEGAS HERE WE COME. The turn-out might be so great that Ellis may need to book the Taj Mehal. CC

You're doing a "Bang-up job Keith", keep up the great work, now we can all cuddle in the 4D Forum. Hope we are all successful and take away plenty of money from the Casino's coffers. CC

Not much has happened in 4D forum as we Ellis us not around. Tha should change soon CC

And here we thought the Aliens were after him, knowing Ellis, he's been working on 4D in his head. CC

Ellis is a strong spirited man and a fighter at that too. I'm sure he will be well soon and I wish for his health to improve quickly. Please pass on my best wishes for good health and when he is ready to return we welcome him here with open arms. The 4D Gang awaits, PS: let Ellis know that I had more successful 4D live play. CC

Ya he's probably sitting back and enjoying the process as we are all just like little kids on Christmas Eve waiting for Santa to bring our toys under the tree, the suspense is killing us all..... Santa Ellis..... Is coming to town. As 4D situations dance in our heads... The Casino's should be scared sh*tless., perhaps they're offering Ellis a large sum of $$$$ not to pursue with 4D! CC

I'm sure he is well, if there was a problem we would have been notified by someone close to him..... Don't you just love the suspenseful moments coming up to 4D being unveiled? Yes, I too hope Ellis is well. CC

Both ! You need to consider both events and will bee explained more clearly in Ellis's update soon to be published on the forum, please be patient. CC

That is very strange then, I'm sure it will be sorted out soon.... Ellis has been very quiet today CC

YES, I believe that you are correct, there are some members who do have access like myself and others not, hopefully this can be resolved soon as Ellis has promised to unveil the 4D instructions starting today 11/14/13. ** I think that the members who signed up and registered for the Webinar a couple weeks ago and paid the $129.95 fee all got access, but I've heard from another source that Grandfathered NOR members are to receive access as well. Ellis or Keith may have to step in and clarify this. ** Don't worry, up to this time of my posting, Ellis has not posted the 4D update as of yet, but I can assure you that this will be something worthy of your greatest attention and use as a result of the accuracy it predicts. See you all soon in 4D Forum, please be patient. CC

YES NEMO, that's correct, we are very serious BAC players here and when we say, "the best players in the world", we mean it... Not just bragging, but can prove it Learning NOR does take some time as you learn to see the shoe develop in a unique perspective that you have not witnessed before. You will recognize what type of shoe it is and know how to bet to win consistently. Baccarat, has a bias and our methods exploit that bias effectively. The NOR fee is worth the admission alone to the forum as we make further progress to becoming better "every day". Having the manual alone is the basis of NOR and you will have access to all subsequent changes as "we" the members exchange new ideas as the game evolves change. The casinos are aware of our group and try to do things to discourage our play but can't because we are not cheating, we are advantage players and dealers will see that and believe it or not, the dealers will respect you because they personally want to learn your methods. Over the years, the game of Baccarat has changed with modern technology to a point of pre-shuffled cards out of the box designed for baccarat in mind, etc... The systems and other developers you see online are most likely outdated and worked ok in older conditions that present shoe types that we don't see anymore. NOR is the current answer and is very adaptable and you will learn about an exciting system that is developing right now that is extremely accurate, but if you are not a member, you will not fully understand and see changes as they occur. I'd better stop here before I re-write the manual.... Not convinced yet?, you can keep playing the way you do now, or..... Instead of being a player that is "NO WHERE", you can be "NOW HERE" it's all in the perception view you choose, so.... Come join the smartest Baccarat players in the world, you be thankful for our encouragement posted here. CC

Your example looks like S40M1 with 2 OTR's, just a coincidence? How would the net bets change if there were a couple of B's mixed in the P sequence? CC

Wow, looks like I set a bomb on this forum with partner suggestion / net betting and looks very powerful from Ellis's postings. When using 4D counts, your sample uses P/B, but I'm assuming that lowest disparity can be other counts but P/B would be earliest count as it starts right at the beginning while waiting for 4th column time kick in. Would the 4th not be lowest at that point? Or where or how do we wait for it to evolve before selecting that column or others? Gee I hope I'm not asking a question of the obvious.... CC

Yes, this was my second option in my post about this suggestion, I just didn't use the term net betting, thanks for your insight Ellis, and sounds like this could be an interesting approach but perhaps S40M1 vs NOR+ utilizing all 3 systems including switching. I see your point with high PA Ellis. CC

Here's an interesting thought, since two system rant the same and will sometimes agree with each other..... In team play with two people with joint bankroll, perhaps it may be possible for one to use SM40M1 and the other play OTB4L simultaneously the outcome of the units won/loss differential or positive would be interesting to test or observe if it can actually work? Or... If one were clever enough to track both system simultaneously and play the differential bet units from both system,.... And select one system over the other, hmmmm.... Complex, but you never know.. Just food for thought, comments? CC

Gee Ellis, I thought you'd be excited to meet me after all these years and phone calls,,, LOL I will be singing up soon but need to confirm travel itinerary first. CC

Yep, looks like yours truly will be attending this one..... Just broke the news to the wife, we decided to cancel our one week ski vacation to go visit Ellis. Lol 4D all the way, and we will have a little getaway in Vegas. What location is the seminar? CC

So.... If one finds that S40 M1 is not working during play, do we abandon the shoe or change to NOR. OTB4L, etc ? Not all shoes like S40 M1. To the TT's CC

Well I finally got a chance to watch some of the video, and made my webinar fee back in less than 8 minutes of play... PRICELESS ! Thanks Ellis CC

Sounds awesome Ellis, can wait up till the video recording is available, I'm really stoked! I could really use a higher hit rate and interested to see your insight to 4D. I've noticed some interesting things about 4D on my own, and observed that OR and 3D , 4D combined assists a player to start in the correct system and takes some of the guess work out of it. Hint; the relationship of +1 / 0, and -1 movement near the beginning of the shoe seems to indicate consistency from that point on. I've been using it live for a little over 2 weeks now and observations keep jumping out at me and this is something that was starring at me that I noticed and compared to past shoes. But hey, I believe you know better than me. I'm a Ginny pig tester. Ha ha at least I'm a winning one. CC

Seriously, @ $600. It's a Bargain, the $$$ I've made from makes the fee look like nothing. CC

Hey Ellis, I hope all went well with the webinar, as said before, I will have to view the recording later and would like to know how I go about doing so? And how soon? Thanks CC

"If you Build it, People will Come" CC