johnnycs1 Posted March 28, 2017 Report Share Posted March 28, 2017 9 hours ago, ozscouser1 said: From the "Forum that cannot be named" Ellis Davis says: March 27, 2017 at 10:15 am How to REGISTER for the May 8th Vegas Invincible Player seminar: Guys be sure to Register. We need an accurate official head count to know what size room to get. We don’t want anybody getting there only to find we ran out of room. I wouldn't stress out too much Ellis...Given recent cancellations of Seminars and low participation of paying attendees at others...I figure that a half decent telephone box should do the trick... I know...I know...Bad Oz! Seminars...Seminars...Seminars ???.......HAS TIME FOR SEMINARS , BUT CLAIMS FOR VARIOUS REASONS ....his health, water lines froze , girlfriends in the hospital....computer broke down AGAIN !!.........etc etc etc...........MANUAL THAT HE TOOK PEOPLES MONEY FOR OVER 2 YEARS AGO ...HAS NOT HAD TIME TO FINISH !! ......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users brad01 Posted March 29, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 No point to finish it Johnny the casino spies have already hacked the computer and made every strategy redundant. Only way is to learn the next best system before they find out Now hurry up and register before its too late!! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 29, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 1 hour ago, brad01 said: No point to finish it Johnny the casino spies have already hacked the computer and made every strategy redundant. Only way is to learn the next best system before they find out Now hurry up and register before its too late!! Yeah...Those sneaky Casino Bastards change the cards everytime they see Ellis and his Disciples enter the Casino... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 29, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, BigChips said: I purchased Ellis mvd system. It does work well WHEN the shoe agrees with it. I can say this. There is a best system for every shoe, mvd, nor, mdb, BUT, also there is a shoe that can beat each system. So, overall does this not make baccarat End up at 50/50 anyways? There is no system and there never will be a system that will beat every shoe and what are in effect "Mechanical Systems" like MvD and MDB, will hit a lot more losing shoes than those who "Follow the Shoe". To follow the shoe means that you are letting the shoe tell you what to do (as much as is possible) When I'm playing, I am scrutinising over 20 separate happenings/events in the shoe to aid my decisions. I am watching for the same events as every system that you have listed but they are only a small part of my thought process. You have to look at the whole picture. Ellis didn't invent MvD...it is a variation on Pattern Recognition and it will win some...lose some. If you have access to the Private Forum, I will try and find time to list all the events that I'm noting before I make each decision to bet, but not out here in the Public Arena. I owe Ellis a lot because, without him, I wouldn't have got started, but others along the way have helped me as much and even then some. He without doubt, has a brilliant mind for Baccarat but he has had only one teacher...himself... I, on the other hand, was able to pick Ellis's brain and was then taken to a greater level by other equally as gifted players. Like I said...Ellis has a brilliant mathematical mind well suited to Baccarat...but one of us earns his living solely from Baccarat (and Roulette) and the other, sells systems... Go figure... Edited March 29, 2017 by ECD 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 29, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 (edited) On 3/29/2017 at 1:13 AM, johnnycs1 said: Seminars...Seminars...Seminars ???.......HAS TIME FOR SEMINARS , BUT CLAIMS FOR VARIOUS REASONS ....his health, water lines froze , girlfriends in the hospital....computer broke down AGAIN !!.........etc etc etc...........MANUAL THAT HE TOOK PEOPLES MONEY FOR OVER 2 YEARS AGO ...HAS NOT HAD TIME TO FINISH !! ......... Personally...I think the Seminars that Ellis runs are a good idea, because it gives the same old crew a chance to meet up and socialise some... kinda like Baccarat Groupies. Socialising apart...in the main it does seem to be the same people fronting up each time with a few extra bods to help pay the bills. I'm not sure what they expect different this next Seminar to the one before, and the one before that...but Albert Einstein had his own thoughts on the subject..."Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." (Substitute "Stupidity" for "Insanity" and I think Einstein nailed it) One is even bringing his son along...LOL!...Who wakes up one morning and has a lightbulb moment?..."I think I'll take my son along to a Seminar so that he too can learn to lose money just like his Dad" I know...I know...BAD OZ! Edited March 29, 2017 by ECD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 29, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, BigChips said: Wait? So Ellis loses when he plays baccarat in a casino? Yikes. Then, he should not be qualified to teach or sell manuals or do seminars Just my opinion. I feel Oz is qualified And if there are others also doing as well I would love your input. I have been struggling with this game for so long Obt4l Does well then i lose I play nor Do well then lose Mvd Do good then lose Do MDB Do well then lose So, It does not seem to matter what I do, in the end I lose Never ahead. Even 4D Do well Then lose Hi BigChps, Regarding your comment that Oz should be the teacher. It's not in the best interest of winning players like Oz to spend their time teaching. They make much more money by just playing. Moreover, no one can afford nor are they willing to pay a real pro the actual value of what their advice/methodology is worth. Would you be willing or even capable of paying $100K (and even that would be a bargain) to learn a method that will make you a consistent winner in every shoe? Imagine how much you can make with such information at your fingertips? Does this reasoning make sense to you? CT70 Edited March 29, 2017 by ECD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pando Posted March 29, 2017 Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 Quote from Oz If you have access to the Private Forum, I will try and find time to list all the events that I'm noting before I make each decision to bet, but not out here in the Public Arena. Oz, Thank you for the offer to put that information in the Private Forum. I for one would really appreciate such a valuable contribution regards Pando Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users brad01 Posted March 29, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 29, 2017 I would like to nominate Oz for PR person of this forum I think he should run seminars etc He is such a people person and displays a lot of patience in teaching beginners! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 30, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 17 minutes ago, BigChips said: CT70, Is it possible to win every shoe, every day? I would say it's possible to win 85%. I define a win as 3 to 20 units per shoe but usually around 10 to 15 units. My stop loss is -4, however I'm starting the shoe with 1/2 units until I get to +1, then I start flat betting full units. This delays hitting my stop loss and gives me 8 chances to get and stay positive. CT70 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 30, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 3 hours ago, brad01 said: I would like to nominate Oz for PR person of this forum I think he should run seminars etc He is such a people person and displays a lot of patience in teaching beginners! Cheeky sod...LMFAO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 30, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 4 hours ago, Pando said: Quote from Oz If you have access to the Private Forum, I will try and find time to list all the events that I'm noting before I make each decision to bet, but not out here in the Public Arena. Oz, Thank you for the offer to put that information in the Private Forum. I for one would really appreciate such a valuable contribution regards Pando No worries Pando...I'll make a point of listing everything that I'm looking at for each hand. It looks daunting at first but not so hard once you grasp a few ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 30, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 1 hour ago, BigChips said: Hi Oz or anyone, do you win daily. Meaning even on a visit lose some shoes but, still win each day visit? And every visit? I win most days, but I don't win every day...because no-one can win every shoe. My STOP/LOSS is -3 units and in the unlikely event that I hit two consecutive losing shoes first up, I quit the Casino for the day. That gives me a max loss of -6/day which I may hit once a month on average. There is no sound mathematical reason for this habit but it has psychological benefits. My average WIN per shoe is in double figures with just Flat Betting and having the comforting knowledge that my worst day will only take me half a shoe to recover is a real boost. It takes DISCIPLINE to quit when you are ahead... It takes DISCIPLINE to observe your S/L and not chase losses when behind... It takes even more DISCIPLINE after a minor loss to walk away from the Casino and live to fight another day. Without DISCIPLINE, you won't win long term at Baccarat and you would be better off finding something else to do nights. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pando Posted March 30, 2017 Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 1 hour ago, ozscouser1 said: No worries Pando...I'll make a point of listing everything that I'm looking at for each hand. It looks daunting at first but not so hard once you grasp a few ideas. That's great, thank you Pando Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 30, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 10 hours ago, ozscouser1 said: I win most days, but I don't win every day...because no-one can win every shoe. My STOP/LOSS is -3 units and in the unlikely event that I hit two consecutive losing shoes first up, I quit the Casino for the day. That gives me a max loss of -6/day which I may hit once a month on average. There is no sound mathematical reason for this habit but it has psychological benefits. My average WIN per shoe is in double figures with just Flat Betting and having the comforting knowledge that my worst day will only take me half a shoe to recover is a real boost. It takes DISCIPLINE to quit when you are ahead... It takes DISCIPLINE to observe your S/L and not chase losses when behind... It takes even more DISCIPLINE after a minor loss to walk away from the Casino and live to fight another day. Without DISCIPLINE, you won't win long term at Baccarat and you would be better off finding something else to do nights. Great post OZ. I am sure you are in agreement, but discipline is almost as/if not more important than skill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users brad01 Posted March 30, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 Hi Big Chips, I have a few words of advice for you. 1) Don't spend any money on any more systems - you already have enough of those and you already know there is no HG (note - this forum is no longer a system selling site but a players forum or 'club' if you like where we just discuss what strategies work and is a monthly fee not a lump sum outlay to buy winning systems) 2) Don't try too hard to find winning bets - let them come to you. If you try too hard to find bets then you start creating patterns and biases in your mind that aren't really there and placing bets that you shouldn't make. Know your winning shoe types and triggers and learn to sit back and wait patiently until those situations present. If it means your shoe average is only 2 - 3 units then so be it I daresay Oz didn't average double figures when he started playing full time. I think at one point he said his average was only 2 - 3 units per shoe and pretty sure it was a lot of hard work and practise to get that average where it is now. My average is 3 - 5 units at the moment depending on the entry point. If I enter towards the end of a shoe I'm happy to exit with just 1 unit profit. If I start form the start and I hit a decent total and it starts falling then I will quit with a win rather than keep playing and risk losing what I already have. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 30, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 1 minute ago, brad01 said: Hi Big Chips, I have a few words of advice for you. 1) Don't spend any money on any more systems - you already have enough of those and you already know there is no HG (note - this forum is no longer a system selling site but a players forum or 'club' if you like where we just discuss what strategies work and is a monthly fee not a lump sum outlay to buy winning systems) 2) Don't try too hard to find winning bets - let them come to you. If you try too hard to find bets then you start creating patterns and biases in your mind that aren't really there and placing bets that you shouldn't make. Know your winning shoe types and triggers and learn to sit back and wait patiently until those situations present. If it means your shoe average is only 2 - 3 units then so be it I daresay Oz didn't average double figures when he started playing full time. I think at one point he said his average was only 2 - 3 units per shoe and pretty sure it was a lot of hard work and practise to get that average where it is now. My average is 3 - 5 units at the moment depending on the entry point. If I enter towards the end of a shoe I'm happy to exit with just 1 unit profit. If I start form the start and I hit a decent total and it starts falling then I will quit with a win rather than keep playing and risk losing what I already have. That's great advice Brad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users brad01 Posted March 30, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 Thanks CT it means a lot Now that I can win consistently and more importantly not lose consistently its a matter of time till my BR / unit size increases to the point where I can do this full time. I cant wait but trying to stay calm. Its real hard when you are trying to balance this with other work commitments as it does require a lot of time but until that time generates you money you have to keep doing what you are doing. Its a real hard one. Then I'm gonna cruise around and visit all BTC members around the world Pando in NZ Oz in Sydney Zeckam in Singapore William Looi in Malaysia Lou in UK and many others and of course many guys in the US including yourself I can totally get what BigChips is saying as sure everyone has been at the point they wonder is this really possible? Push past the point and you will find out it absolutely is For sure I would say the answer is no magical method or system but hard work and being able to talk and converse with members and players who have been through this and made it That place was and is this forum 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 30, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 30, 2017 Hey Brad, I didn't see my name. Aren't you going to visit me?...lol CT70 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users RonO Posted March 31, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 On 3/19/2017 at 6:02 PM, way2fast said: Your description and review of MvD is spot on. Casinos are scared and mess with the game when they see Ellis coming? Hilarious. Maybe some newbies fall for the BS, but anyone who has been in a casino can see right through the "stories." Carlos (the tester) contacted several of us at BTC. I have quite an exchange of PM's with him where he was bashing Ellis and Dean, while trying to get me to send him details on exactly how I was playing as well as specific details on VinSap. Then he discovered he could sign up for one month and download everything. After he did that he wouldn't even pay for his one month. Total scumbag -- I put him in the same bucket as Dean. Fortunately he is CFC's problem. Carlos is a scumbag who ripped me for a few thousand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users brad01 Posted March 31, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 55 minutes ago, CT70 said: Hey Brad, I didn't see my name. Aren't you going to visit me?...lol CT70 Of course mate but too many names to list in USA ! McVince, way2fast, trbfla, trillion, douglas, kachatz, Keith, Mike...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users ECD Posted March 31, 2017 Author Users Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 1 hour ago, brad01 said: as it does require a lot of time but until that time generates you money you have to keep doing what you are doing. Its a real hard one. Yes Brad. Holding a full time job and keeping up with playing regularly is exhausting. Every real shoe played in a casino should be replayed again in your home environment. Usually the replay should end in a higher score. Shoes ending in a low score should be analyzed to see what if anything you could have done better. This is a great learning excercise. It's amazing what you notice you have overlooked when you replay the shoe. The replays and analysis take up a lot of time but it's critical to do and definitely worth lt. CT70 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users brad01 Posted March 31, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 Thanks CT just starting to realise that this is the key to 'just winning' and becoming a high level player. One of the things I learned form your posts Also Oz's work ethic with this is second to none hence the results he gets Also the Stats For Profit is a good way to get one into the habit of homework after playing by at least entering the shoes into the program Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Users brad01 Posted March 31, 2017 Users Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 2 hours ago, RonO said: Carlos is a scumbag who ripped me for a few thousand Sorry to hear that RonO As hard as it may be let it go Focus on yourself moving forward Surround yourself with good people, stay away from the bad. I can honestly say I have only talked to good people on this forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pando Posted March 31, 2017 Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 15 minutes ago, brad01 said: Thanks CT just starting to realise that this is the key to 'just winning' and becoming a high level player. One of the things I learned form your posts Also Oz's work ethic with this is second to none hence the results he gets Also the Stats For Profit is a good way to get one into the habit of homework after playing by at least entering the shoes into the program A great feature of StatsforProfits is that a shoe can be re-played hand by hand So rather than seeing the whole shoe, you can retrieve each hand as you would do in a casino I find that very beneficial to practice as you and CT70 suggest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baccarat Hall of Fame Member wolfat Posted March 31, 2017 Baccarat Hall of Fame Member Report Share Posted March 31, 2017 BigChips, Brad gave you advices you should put on stone... I want to add something "practical" that could help you. I guess, in the past, you jumped from a "winning" system to the next one and couldn't find the right one. you know why? because it DOES NOT EXIST. what you must do is this: as I think you have a ton of "good systems" to play, choose that one fits more your betting style, I mean, are you a conservative player? do you like more action? etc choose that one fitting more your style. put yourself on a kitchen table and play MANUALLY at least hundred shoes. analyze them after playing. check if you played well, what's went right or wrong, try to outline weaknesses and strengths. after all this work I ASSURE YOU you will be a better player, you will be able to get in a good shoe and out from a bad one, EARLY, without depleting your bankroll. Nothing can substitute MANUAL PRACTCE! More, in general, read everything you can about bac to get new ideas for improvements BUT don't deviate from your path! don't be afraid to share your ideas with good people here, you will receive more than you give. I suggest you subscribing our premium membership and read my booklet about baccarat mindset, everyone read it appreciated it a lot! NEVER GIVE UP! A 3 Quote bacclover Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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